Another idea on player training

[The Shadow Nose]

I have read over several threads on player training and have come up with a system that may work.

1. An NPC teaches the 'Teaching' skill which is a job skill

2. The teacher can teach all the theoretical knowledge they have for skills up to their teaching level.
so a teacher with lvl 0 and theoretical in Teaching, lvl 5 in Sword Combat and lvl 3 with theoretical in Mining can teach Teaching, Sword Combat, and Mining for the theoretical of lvl 0.

Base stats like Strength and Agility have much higher levels than the others, perhaps for the base stats, the limit its five times the Teaching skill level. so a teaching level of 30 could to teach strength to its maximum of 150.

at Teaching lvl 10 with no theoretical they can teach the theoretical for all skills except those of lvl 10 and above.


3. When a player has the teaching skill, then the 'Train' action can only be used on them by a member of their group. This should prevent players from pestering trainers too much. right clicking shows the train icon to group members.

4. This brings up the training screen where the student selects the skill to learn, they select it and hit 'Purchase skill'

5. The trainer gets a message "Do you want to train <student name> for <level> in <skill name> ?" they can accept or decline.

6. Hopefully, the total cost in PP and tria for the skill will be deducted at once to save both parties from pressing 'purchase skill' and 'accept' all day. There may be a waiting bar that appears as is one was casting a spell to show the time needed to explain the theory.

7. The cost in pp and tria is the same as if it was taken by an NPC trainer. The pp cannot be avoided because its what students use to learn an the tria vanishes from the system to represent resources being used up. The student pays both costs, if the teacher wants more money for himself, he asks that money be given to him. If the teacher wants to elliviate the cost of training, he gives the student some money.

8. Teachers get practice points in Teaching for each time they teach a student all the theoretical for a level. Perhaps even a little experience because teachers also learn from their students. The amount would be about as much as digging for ore (perhaps its usually just a few xp like failing to get ore with the chance of getting more, like succeding).

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With trainers being more available, and the tria being used up, it would provide a sort of money sink perhaps a little more than there is already. Though it could cause quite a bit of powerleveling.

Another idea would be to have a quest to get a Teaching Book which must be put in the mind slot to allow a teacher to train. This could create a limit on the number of teachers available or perhaps limit the types of skills they can train. (i.e. Job Skills, Combat Skills, Various Skills, Basic stats, etc)


Does this system look viable?

[Gondric]

i like the idea. justa little idea of mine u need to buy the skill first off then u can train it up lets say 10 lvls then ud be advanced in that skill without needing to train again then u get to like expert.

Not tryin to steal ur thread

[The Shadow Nose]

Oh no, I'd really like to see suggestions to improve this system so that when we get player-training it will be as balanced as possible.

But I'm not sure if I get what you are saying.

You mean that with most skills like Metallurgy or Mining then level 10 is about the most you would need to teach, so they would just stop there? Yeah, sounds about right.

How about all the different classes of skills get treated with different multipliers to determine how much you can teach?

So:
MaxTrainInStats = TeachLevel * 15
MaxTrainInCombat = TeachLevel * 2
MaxTrainInMagic = TeachLevel * 2
MaxTrainInJobs = TeachLevel * 1
MaxTrainInVarious = TeachLevel *1

So a level of 10 in Teaching would get stats to 150, combat and magic to 20, and jobs and Various to 10. Are these about the maximums?

[Under the moon]

Yes, it is a good idea. It has also been talked about before. I can't remember what side of the fence the game will take, though.

RP-wise, this makes much sense, as anyone who knows anything can try to impart that knowledge on another person. The question remains if that knowledge was pasted on correctly. The Teaching skill is a must for that. It should also be a very hard skill to get. Perhaps even awarded by GMs. I would hate to see the game full of teacher/miner/swordmen/mage characters. There are too many folks who are maxed in all of these as it is.

[The Shadow Nose]

Meh, I'd rather see some maxed out characters when everyone has access to things than have a few strut around with specail abilities nobody else can access.

I mean, why play a game when its just going to turn into real life?

I don't mind so much the guy who can kill ubernauts with one strike of his sword, becaseu I know that if I really try I can learn to do that same thing.

If there is someone who can teach skills only because his buddy the GM gave him that ability and I can never hope to get that skill... well my indignation is definatly justified.

I say, make the skill relitively easy to acess but very difficult to master so only a few would care to turn into trainers and if they can still kill ubernauts with one strke then heck I'm signing up to learn from him. Better that than the alternative.

[Sohai]

I fully agree on the above.
I sounds to much as favoritisme if a GM has the power to give such a skill.
Nobody likes elites and ´special´groups.

What if....

From a certain "age" u have the ability to start a teachers qeust.
It would encompass some of the basic skills u picked up during ur life in PS .
Im not saying any John doe should be able to pick the skill up, thats why IMO ingame age is a requirement to even begin the qeust.

It could send u all over the world collecting the materials needed to finish the qeust, it can even be a qeust in several steps so it would take a fair amount of time to finish it.
It could even require some objects created by players, so u would also need to find a person able to create the object for u.
(unfortenatly guilds spoil the fun in those situations but none the less)

In the end only  long time players would be able to learn the skill.
But most important EVERYBODY can learn the skill if they rlly wanted to.
Wich is far more fun then having a select few who were at the right time on the right place. GM generated content is cool but skill wise it creates more discontempt then it does good.

[bilbous]

I am wondering why you need to have a pc training system at all. It seems to me that how it could work would be to make the training completely optional. What I mean by this is that with training you progress at the current rate; without training you progress at a fraction of this rate--but you still progress. You could also build in a modifier proportional to the average of stats relevant to the skill. It doesn't make sense that you only learn things when there is someone to teach it to you unless perhaps you want to say that all knowledge was given by the gods directly to the first mortal teachers. It would seem more logical that the gods designed the way things work and perhaps gave hints to certain favored mortals and then sat back to be amused by the inventiveness of their creations. If you had this constant learning in effect you would not need player trainers.

As far as Progression Points go in this scheme  you could make the requirement for achieving the next level of the skill without a trainer be to generate the requisite number of PPs for the trainer cost pursuing the trade at the reduced rate so that if it cost 25 PPs to gain the next level buying from a trainer and your marginal rate was 10% you would need to generate 250 PPs practicing your craft to gain the next level without a trainer. These PPs would be expended at "graduation".  If you choose to buy training part way through your practice you could be credited with the marginal value for whatever practice you have generated.

For example: I have no skill at mining which I want to learn so I go to Trasok and buy training up to level 1. All well and good so far no change. I go out and I mine gold and it so happens  - for the sake of argument - that I fill up with 1 practice left before I level. I go and sell out and return to the mine. I could not buy more training because I had not completed the previous training. I am at the mine and the very first success gets me the level. I could rush back and buy more training or I could fill up without it. I choose to fill up. Now every success is getting me a reduced amount of practice Let us say my marginal rate is 11% because I am learning rudimentary techniques and I have a little aptitude. If I can carry 15 more ore I will get 1.65 PPs for the successes and some small amount for the failures -- say .35 PP. When I go back and sell out and purchase my training I will be credited with the 2 practice. I still need to pay the full PP cost for the training but I am 2 practices ahead.

The numbers I have used are completely arbitrary for the purposes of the example. The actual values would be subject to balance considerations.

[Anne Ominous]

I'm gonna stick to the original post..

I started off thinking ok, there's the idea for player training players again... But then you grabbed me. The Book Idea.
Makes me imagine each skill & stat having a book, each book needing a quest to be obtained. Each also needing full in that skill or stat to train another. Rp-wise that makes more sense to me on many levels, when you consider the npc sword trainers would kill you for taking their business, unless you were so skilled too (or higher trainers wouldn't train you as they here what you did to someone in their union's business)...
A nice way to keep this a lil more balanced than just book & skill/stat rquired to equip specific books, would be one overall teaching skill that determines how high you can train any of the skills you could train.

also i like the idea about trainin up a certain amout just by doing more of it, but have to admit thats a bit too easy unless as you suggested, 10X or more the amount of time