Issue with fixing weapons

[Nikodemus]

As far as i know, currently the only way to restore quality of given weapon is to:
1. Give it to a PC who has skills and does it
2. Wait till he finish
3. Accept when the PC gives the fixed weapons back and optionaly pay for the service.

The issue is...
What if the PC won't give the item away? you can do nothing about it. Currently the only way to stop chaos is you can't rob anyone and everythink what is in inventory will stay there as long as the owner wishes so.
This is flawed when you want to fix your weapons and thus giving them to someone else.

I think near the current way of fixing weapons, we need another special interface.
For the PC with weapons - inventory window and window where you drop weapons to be fixed
For the PC who fixes - window where he see weapons which was put there by the other PC and where he has buttons for fixing them.
This way the weapons are always in the true owner propety and the system isn't flawed. If a crash would happen, dishonest PC, the items will always be in the true owner inventory.

[Syilph]

Here are 2 other ways to fix weapons
1: Train weapon repairing. It will be rather boring and time consuming but you won't have to ask nobody to do it for you.
2: Create a smith character and if you chose your character creation features right, you can end up with a lvl 15 in weapons repair.

And now to the issue of this post:
If you give an item to somebody and that guy ninjas it, well... there is no way for you to proove that you gave him/her that item in the first place. So, there is no way to get it back.
Your solution might work well because people will be able to make a job out of repairing weapons this way. But at the same time, I think that there will be alot of people that will chose this job to earn some trias, and in time people will know who to trust. And I think that a reputation can be built faster than a game feature.

[Datruth]

Here are 2 other ways to fix weapons
1: Train weapon repairing. It will be rather boring and time consuming but you won't have to ask nobody to do it for you.
2: Create a smith character and if you chose your character creation features right, you can end up with a lvl 15 in weapons repair.

And now to the issue of this post:
If you give an item to somebody and that guy ninjas it, well... there is no way for you to proove that you gave him/her that item in the first place. So, there is no way to get it back.
Your solution might work well because people will be able to make a job out of repairing weapons this way. But at the same time, I think that there will be alot of people that will chose this job to earn some trias, and in time people will know who to trust. And I think that a reputation can be built faster than a game feature.

Response to 1: So in other words, we are forced to train weapon repairing, what if we don't want to? Or what if our Character abhors it?

Response to 2: How would you switch weapons between the two characters?

The best way, would be to go into an alley, and drop the weapon, then log in with the other one, and then pick it up.

THIS Is inherently flawed though, Why? because again, WHAT do you do if the server crashes?

Most often, you lost the weapon you paid 200k for.

Not a good idea.

I think the first post, clearly, explains what needs to be done.

[Syilph]

Response to 2: How would you switch weapons between the two characters?

By simply creating the second char on another account or by asking a friend to transfer the weapons to your smithy.
IMO there should also be a NPC that repairs weapons in a quite remote place, so with the expense of some money and time to walk there, people could get their items repaired in a safe environement.

[Datruth]

Response to 2: How would you switch weapons between the two characters?

By simply creating the second char on another account or by asking a friend to transfer the weapons to your smithy.

Good point, have a friend hold the weapon and switch it, forgot about that.

But couldn't a friend just fix your weapon for you as well?

Currently, my weapon fixing comes from this way.

2 very good friends of mine Kitiranna and Maerghaine always help me repair my weapons, and they do it for free too.

You can see them at harnquists, and i'm sure they'd help you out as well.

They are amazing and i always feel as if i owe a debt to them.

With good people like them, you will always have a great player enviornment and TON's of fun.

Again, they are great people, even if you don't need your weapons repaired, they'll give you a great conversation and you'll make two of the best friends you've ever met.

~~Datruth

[Nikodemus]

Syliph, we can do 1) and 2) but they both aren't natural bahaviour, exactly because they are troublesome.
Afterall we don't want all to do the same, but rather specialise. Specialising is exactly what is hapeing now.
IMO, NPCs shouldn't be allowed to repair weapons, because what is happening now is really incredible. We gained feature and almost instantly people found themselves in the new situation and the lack of NPCs who repair weapons isn't a problem at all. In fact it's a problem for PL who don't want to talk and interact, finally there is a way to decrease this group and make room for roleplayers.

There are already trustwothly people and with good reputation, like Kitiranna.
This people are needed in this situation:
When a given person can't fix your weapon currently, but after that peson fix wapons of others who gave them already. Yes, people give weapons, walk away, and come back later for fixed weapon.
Next thing which wouldn't happen with NPCs is:
You give them weapons to repair and instantly get already fixed weapons, because the PC who fix them had weapons of this type.

We just need what i explained in first post and near all this what is already in place, we will never have to risk loosing our weapons.

[Syilph]

My point was that if you want a 100% certainty of geting your weapon(s) back, a do-it-yourself solution might give you that.
A game-mechanics solution will be rether more difficult to implement and it will take time also. And by the time that solution would be implemented, we'll have a few trust-worthy people that will be specialised in repairing weapons or armour.
Besides, this uncertainty you have when giving an item to another PS for repairs adds more to the realistic feeling. IRL for example you don't always have that assurance that after giving something to somebody you never met, you'll get that something back

[neko kyouran]

But, IRL you go to a reputable dealer, craftsman, repair shop, what have you.  And IRL, there is a way to show proof of ownership, and a way to get your items back.


If WoW has a way that allows enchanters to enchant other peoples weapons without ever havign to actually trade, (I believe it is done right through the trade window.  Not sure though, I don't play that game) then I'm sure the Devs of PS can come up with a solution for repairing weapons and armor as well.

[Nikodemus]

Besides, this uncertainty you have when giving an item to another PS for repairs adds more to the realistic feeling. IRL for example you don't always have that assurance that after giving something to somebody you never met, you'll get that something back

You are boring to death, do you even realise how many people before you tried this argument and they were wrong? What are you trying to prove? Sorry, this kind of argments make me really annoyed.
Answering:
If the smith refuse to give my weapons back, I smash his head, take my weapons and everythink what he had. Now, this is realistic feeling, not what you have described.
Or i do what neko said.

[Pestilence]

Think Nikodemus has a good point. One shouldn't have to risk the loss of weapons everytime someone is repairing your weapons.

Sure in RL it wouldn't always be to trustworthy either, but in RL people would normally be a lot more worried about loss of reputation after having spend a lot of money on setting up shop or you could even try to get the item back through force.

Glad my char did have some weaponrepair from creation that is enough to repair my silverweave dagger to be honest. I mean normally nothing would happen as you would pick trustworthy people, but seeing how rare silverqeaves are in the game once is enough to ruin the game for quite some time.

[Xordan]

I agree totally, the current system isn't good. I like the system that WoW has, where there's a non-tradeable' box which allows the other person to manipulate the item (such as adding an enchant) without you actually having to give it to them.

[zhai]

I think that a safe "repair" window would help and it wouldn't hurt the interaction between players that already exists. Yes, reputation is very important but there might be those who won't care about it. I remember an incident in Dwarvesbane where a member lent his daggers to a fellow DB only to have them stolen. The character, being in the same guild, was supposed to be trustworthy but then logged off and deleted himself (which, IMHO is totally OOC lame: the IC way to do it should have been to just run off and face the consequences of his theft). If this sort of thing can happen in a guild (yes, you can say that it was the players fault and no "cheat" was resorted to, that's been discussed, and it's not the point here), I can only see it coming eventually in the case of repair. What if a player is mad at another one OOC and creates an alt to be a repairman. He could then steal and delete the items of the player he wants to get or just do this to steal from other players.

On the other hand, many of our characters are RPed as warriors. I personally think that part of being a warrior is to be able to take care of their weapons, as well as to take care of wounds. I trained my character to do just so, not to be an expert in repair, but to have suffcient knowledge in the matter to repair her own blades. Being a ranger, she might not be near anyone with the skill to help for a while when she's out of town. That seems right for my character.

Finally, I don't quite understand why those who like axes have it so difficult: strong axes are the toughest to loot, they are the most complicated and the slowest to repair and they also happen to be quite slow in battle... I'm ok with the last feature (I've been sent to the DR bench by axe swings many times, so it's a matter of skill), but the first two might need to be addressed. After all, we don't want all characters to use the same kind of weapons, that's an OOC strategy to gain an edge in combat. I don't want to go off-topic here but why are they so hard to repair? Do all weapons wear out at the same speed?

[Syilph]

On the other hand, many of our characters are RPed as warriors. I personally think that part of being a warrior is to be able to take care of their weapons, as well as to take care of wounds. I trained my character to do just so, not to be an expert in repair, but to have suffcient knowledge in the matter to repair her own blades. Being a ranger, she might not be near anyone with the skill to help for a while when she's out of town. That seems right for my character.

I agree with you Zhai, a warior should at lest know how to sharpen his/her sword and, yes, having some minor medical knowlege would be required too.

About the safe repair system, don't get me wrong Nikodemus, I agree with you too and I was just trying to explain how a compromise may be reached, both RP and non-RP wise, untill such system would be implemented. We all know, that might happen "soon" (TM) and we'll just have to make do menwhile. Also, based on your ideea I would like to go even a bit further and suggest a system that would alow you to lend an item to somebody, without giving away the ownership rights, meaning that if you do a special trade with somebody, you'll have the ability (and the coresponding command) to take that item back at any time. That way you could give an item to somebody for a longer period of time, but still have the "power" to take it back (IE lending your swords to somebody you never met before during a tournament)

[Kaerli]

I think that a safe "repair" window would help and it wouldn't hurt the interaction between players that already exists. Yes, reputation is very important but there might be those who won't care about it. I remember an incident in Dwarvesbane where a member lent his daggers to a fellow DB only to have them stolen. The character, being in the same guild, was supposed to be trustworthy but then logged off and deleted himself (which, IMHO is totally OOC lame: the IC way to do it should have been to just run off and face the consequences of his theft). If this sort of thing can happen in a guild (yes, you can say that it was the players fault and no "cheat" was resorted to, that's been discussed, and it's not the point here), I can only see it coming eventually in the case of repair. What if a player is mad at another one OOC and creates an alt to be a repairman. He could then steal and delete the items of the player he wants to get or just do this to steal from other players.

On the other hand, many of our characters are RPed as warriors. I personally think that part of being a warrior is to be able to take care of their weapons, as well as to take care of wounds. I trained my character to do just so, not to be an expert in repair, but to have suffcient knowledge in the matter to repair her own blades. Being a ranger, she might not be near anyone with the skill to help for a while when she's out of town. That seems right for my character.

Finally, I don't quite understand why those who like axes have it so difficult: strong axes are the toughest to loot, they are the most complicated and the slowest to repair and they also happen to be quite slow in battle... I'm ok with the last feature (I've been sent to the DR bench by axe swings many times, so it's a matter of skill), but the first two might need to be addressed. After all, we don't want all characters to use the same kind of weapons, that's an OOC strategy to gain an edge in combat. I don't want to go off-topic here but why are they so hard to repair? Do all weapons wear out at the same speed?

The problem you are speaking of is not just limited to axes;  the wielders of Frosty, Fire, or Dark swords face the same difficulty, as they require their repairers to be at lvl12!  Compare that to lvl3 for a Silverweave SS, and that amounts to an extremely unfair penalty against an otherwise excellent class of swords.  Why would a Frosty SS be so dang hard to repair?

[zhai]

Yes, frosty, dark and fire weapons are harder to repair yet swords are way easier to loot than axes. So, you can even swap between 4 or 6 different swords, wearing them out and still keep getting new ones to ruin whereas in the case of axes, you would be stuck with a blunt pair for a long, long time until either you are able to repair them, find someone to do it for you or loot a replacement pair. They are so uncommon that even medium slash ones are hard to find (and then harder to repair!). Maybe this could be changed. I don't see why they (the medium slash axes) should be harder to get than the medium slash swords.