Seen the ratings?

[Farren Kutter]

Ratings are overrated.

* Farren Kutter's two trias.

[Vengeance]

I think it would be cool to have people post the urls of these sites that are rating us, just so we can keep an eye on them.  Not because they are wrong but because they are right. :-)

I agree that by any objective or commercial standard, PS kinda sucks.  The stability is a major issue--If WoW crashed once a month there'd be riots. :-)  Not sure what to do about download times.  I do agree that the download, install, overlay zip, updater sequence is horrid, but that is just temporary till the next release.

So I guess my verdict is, try not to be objective. :-)  Making games like this turns out to be pretty difficult and even though it seems like we don't do shit, we actually are doing the best that we can.  When you are down about our lack of progress or our seeming incompetence, go look for another game made by volunteers that comes anywhere CLOSE to this one.  I don't think one exists.

- Venge

[Ralleyon]

I think it would be cool to have people post the urls of these sites that are rating us, just so we can keep an eye on them.  Not because they are wrong but because they are right. :-)

I agree that by any objective or commercial standard, PS kinda sucks.  The stability is a major issue--If WoW crashed once a month there'd be riots. :-)  Not sure what to do about download times.  I do agree that the download, install, overlay zip, updater sequence is horrid, but that is just temporary till the next release.

So I guess my verdict is, try not to be objective. :-)  Making games like this turns out to be pretty difficult and even though it seems like we don't do crap, we actually are doing the best that we can.  When you are down about our lack of progress or our seeming incompetence, go look for another game made by volunteers that comes anywhere CLOSE to this one.  I don't think one exists.

- Venge

HARDWARE

Right behind you on that one. As a matter of fact, I've tried to run PS on a server at home and, believe me, my computer is far from being bleeding edge. I mean... yeah, it WAS.... like 4 years ago! Trust me, the server works fine. Not perfect, but still... fine.

Still, a hardware improvement would always be nice and my primary suggestion would be on SCSI hard-drives in RAID arrays. (database operations ring a bell?) In any event, my heart stops even when I think of the costs. Aaaanyway, and my second suggestion would more RAM. Now, if people would donate, say 5 bucks a month or any ammount for that matter (those who can afford it of course), it would REALLY help instead of whining like a crybaby and thinking that everyone has the financial power to buy a high-end computer for personal use in one month.

Datruth, sorry to bring this up to you mate, but you have to grow up a little. Money comes in different shapes and sizes, depending you where everyone lives. Your system there is quite expensive where I live, so don't ask us so innocently why we don't buy better hardware.

So, let's stress this idea a little further. You want better services? Show that you care. Make a donation.

SOFTWARE

Now that we have the hardware thingy out of the way, let me tell you a little about why the server crashes. As I pointed out earlier, the hardware can always be improved, but that is not the problem right now. The server being unavailable is not related due to faulty hardware at all right now. When you see a server reset, either think of a bug and check if it really is one, then report it, or you can think that the devs just fixed something, or are trying to fix something, or added something new and the server program (psserver and psnpclient) need to be restarted so that the modifications take effect. Changing things on the fly is not possible, because, in case you didn't know already... Laanx _IS_ the test server.

LAG

Whenever the game lags badly, remember that the internet connection is donated by Fragnetics. Their bandwidth is surely divided between a lot of services, so this is not our server's fault. Now, don't jump at their throat so fast. Thay are providing this connection FREELY, so that this game has a future and give us a chance to test it. Think you can do better? Are you an ISP or similar? If not, don't even think to complain or try to offer your services. Instead, make a donation.

TRIVIA

Did you know that in the past, Laanx was hosted on the dev's money? Yes, they actually gave money out of their own pockets instead of gatting any for YOU to have a chance to play this game and test it. I may not have played PlaneShift since then, because, the irony of it all, my hardware was too weak to run it, but I do remember how things used to be.

This sort of thing always happens with non-commercial products. PlaneShift is free to play, the source code and tools used to make it are free. There are advantages and disadvantages to this, and as you can plainly see, money is an issue, because the developers working on PS are people just like us, with family, friends, jobs and so on... and they are doing this in their spare time. Stop demanding things, ask nicely. Stop blaming them, 'cause even when they screw up, they're doing the best they can. They are also learning, you know. Some things are easy to do, others that may seem standard issue to you, are hard as hell to put into practice. So, when someone says, have patience and some understanding, perhaps you should consider the above points.

[ Edited for language. --Karyuu ]

[peeg]

First of all: I totally agree with Venge and Ralleyon - great posts.

Hardware:
Laanx' hardware seems to be more than sufficient!
I already posted this, but:

The server code is performing better than expected.
With 150 users online, the server s CPU is around
1% load.

That quote comes from Talad himself

Lag/Connection:
Laanx is located in Singapur ... think about it

Greetings

[Datruth]

Datruth, sorry to bring this up to you mate, but you have to grow up a little. Money comes in different shapes and sizes, depending you where everyone lives. Your system there is quite expensive where I live, so don't ask us so innocently why we don't buy better hardware.

So, let's stress this idea a little further. You want better services? Show that you care. Make a donation.



LAG

Think you can do better? Are you an ISP or similar? If not, don't even think to complain or try to offer your services. Instead, make a donation.


Stop demanding things, ask nicely. Stop blaming them, 'cause even when they screw up, they're doing the best they can. They are also learning, you know. Some things are easy to do, others that may seem standard issue to you, are hard as hell to put into practice. So, when someone says, have patience and some understanding, perhaps you should consider the above points.

I ask everyone to go back and read my original post.

Please do that now, please, go, i'll wait for you                       *****2 minute wait.

As you can see i underlined and Bolded the parts that bothered me.

I especially HATED the red parts. I mean i don't know what this guy is smoking, but he needs to learn some READING Comprehension.

Here were some main points of my post:

I'm sorry, but if your computer can't download or play this game, that's your computers fault.

And you'll have very little problems playing this game.

I don't crash much, and it only happens when the server Hiccups, lol   

I'll admit, it does crash, more than average games, but you'll get used to it.


I frankly feel the dev's don't really need to change anything as to the specs of the game.

I know you guys arn't rolling in money and it's hard for you to afford a server.

That's why i'll live with the server, but i'm openly going to admit I hate that piece of #@@#.

lol.

4) When i figure out how to make my backup computer into a server i'll gladly donate it to PS.

~~Datruth

I never asked anyone to go buy expensive computers. All i did was say IF you can't play PS and download it, YOU need to upgrade your computer and increase your internet speed.

I think everyone agrees with that statement. PS can be run on an average computer and downloaded on an average DSL connection, and if you can't download and play it, IT'S not the devs fault, it's yours.

I even offered to donate my backup PC which has way better specs than the Laanx server, ONCE i figured out how to turn it into a server.

AS you can see, i never flamed the devs at all.

I never flamed anyone in the WHOLE thread, and yet this guy Ralleyon has it out for me and is screaming his lungs out against me.

I have 4 words for you Ralleyon and it's not go make a donation, It's: Go learn to read!

~~Datruth

[Karyuu]

I am getting majorly tired of hostilities here. It is common courtesy to treat the people you are replying to as human beings. Please make sure you do so.

This is directed at the general public.

[Karyuu]

If you don't like someone's post, that doesn't give you any right whatsoever to attack them and become hostile. We all make mistakes and once or twice that can be forgiven. But you should be actively avoiding this. GMs and Devs know when to pull out of an argument to avoid it spiralling downwards (some more than others, granted), but honestly - who is destroying your name in this thread?

No getting hostile. No. Last post about this sort of thing, please continue with your regular program.

[Ralleyon]

@Datruth

Datruth, sorry to bring this up to you mate, but you have to grow up a little. Money comes in different shapes and sizes, depending you where everyone lives. Your system there is quite expensive where I live, so don't ask us so innocently why we don't buy better hardware.

This was the only issue I addressed you directly Datruth. The others things I mentioned here WEREN'T meant stictly for you but for the whole community. I don't particularly understand why you feel so offended.

This rant of yours ends now. I DIDN'T flame you since everything I wrote WASN'T meant for your eyes only. If I had felt anything like that I would have sent a PM.

[Syilph]

If you don't like someone's post, that doesn't give you any right whatsoever to attack them and become hostile. We all make mistakes and once or twice that can be forgiven. But you should be actively avoiding this. GMs and Devs know when to pull out of an argument to avoid it spiralling downwards (some more than others, granted), but honestly - who is destroying your name in this thread?

No getting hostile. No. Last post about this sort of thing, please continue with your regular program.

Yeah! We know when to ask Karyuu to close a thread! Just joking, trying to release the tension floating around

And on topic: It is true that PlaneShift has some bugs (some might say, alot) and it is true that in certain areas people experience lag (more or less depending on the machines they are running PS on) but, again, let's not forget that it is a pre-alpha version of the game, developped by people on their spare time and it is free. Free as in you don't have to pay for it, and you don't have to play if you don't want to or if you don't like it.
The reviews give PS a bad score? Well, let's not forget how the reviews are done. Some guy play-tests a game and according to certain game features will award a score. But a review is not based on the ingame comunity, and IMO, that is the most important thing in an MMO.
And finally, it is a matter of personal taste, you can like a game or you can dislike a game but that doesn't mean that a game is bad, that means only that from your point of view it is bad.

[neko kyouran]

A tad off topic, but my own personal opinion would put the game at alpha stage.  But then again, what's in a name?  Would a rose not smell as sweet if it were to be called elsewise?

[Pestilence]

* Pestilence looks at Syilph

AAHHH prealpha? Does the dev team even know what that means? That means the work you do BEFORE the alpha. And the alpha is the first version you can walk around and actually start doing things and believe me since CB we have long left the PRE-alpha behind.

* Pestilence grumbles

[Xordan]

I'd call PS 'alpha' right now

[Easton]

To me..

Alpha means you walk around with a 3d (or 2d) avatar and talk with people. Sometimes PvP is in place along with a very basic economy (depending on the game of course). Bascially, it's a way to test a game for the Devs, and for yourself. If it really needs a lot more work but you like the potential, you make a note in your head and come back in a year or so.

Now, with that being said, i have to say that Planeshift is the only (Pre)Alpha game out there that people can actually stick with for years, and actually feel like they are playing a full game. It's amazing to me. I've watched PS grow in every direction for more than a year and a half, and sometimes i feel like not much has changed, but then i really think about it... there were only basic weapons, no armor, a fraction of the amount of quests we have now, a fraction of the map size we have now, hardly any magic, if any, many less NPCs, no variation in features of characters, no weather system, it was always day time, no variation in GUI, etc..

When you sit and think about where PS was a year ago, you can't help but smile, really. And all the while the community has been grateful and understanding (for the most part), and remained, in my opinion, the best community out there.

If you feel stressed, donate, contribute, join the dev team. Personally, i think people that criticize too quickly are not thinking very well, but i think its a good thing that Datruth gave an objective point of view of the game and some of the factors surrounding it that may be inhibiting the overall experience. But all the more reason to help out in some way, right?

Easton Ghent

[Vengeance]

We call it pre-alpha because we don't consider it alpha until it is "feature complete" for the vision we have had since 2001 or before.  Believe it or not, that vision really hasn't changed much and probably won't.  My personal view is that Steel Blue release (0.4) will be the last pre-alpha release and 0.5 will be called "alpha", but who knows and who cares.  :-)

It's just a label--one that really only applies to commercial software that has a defined end point when everyone moves on to other projects.

- Vengeance

[Datruth]

We call it pre-alpha because we don't consider it alpha until it is "feature complete" for the vision we have had since 2001 or before.  Believe it or not, that vision really hasn't changed much and probably won't.  My personal view is that Steel Blue release (0.4) will be the last pre-alpha release and 0.5 will be called "alpha", but who knows and who cares.  :-)

It's just a label--one that really only applies to commercial software that has a defined end point when everyone moves on to other projects.

- Vengeance

Just curious Venge, how long untill we get another race with their own City?

I mean, who is next, which race?

Are the dwarves getting thier own city next? If so when?

What will it be called?

Will all races get their own cities?