Hydlaa Law enforcement

[ThomPhoenix]

Chancellor as leader of a "Police squad"? Chancellor can be used for officers in a military or in a court, but I've never heard it associated with police.

And yeah, I said the same things Parallo said, but Narure is avoiding to answer them?

[Parallo]

And yeah, I said the same things Parallo said, but Narure is avoiding to answer them?

Great minds, eh?

But seriously. Why would anyone support someone that want to impose various laws and run for governmental position without even knowing said person's policies?

[Sangwa]

Narure's joking obviously. This is not serious attempt, or we would have noticed it before.

Plus "Hydlaa Law Enforcement" sounds way too pretensious. I mean, it's named after the city, and supposedly its law. And I don't see anyone, Vigesimi or Octarch, assuming anyone else as Hydlaa's Law Enforcement guild. I agree with the creation of a guard, it can't have such a pretensious name though.

[sstoykaa]

WOW


ok, let me sit here and think how to respond to all these post.

hmmm, first of all everyone wants the run down on the forums, and well you will find out ingame for most of it.

as for the laws.... for one i saw something about being democratic.... is democracy real, or believable in midevil times?

Narure...... you dont trust him, yet maybe he changed his ways. before everyone starts distrusting the guild, have information of something the guild did wrong =).

i had no idea this would get so much backlash, but keep saying it cant, wont, might not work. all great people had haters.

[ThomPhoenix]

WOW

You didn't answer any of our questions.

[sstoykaa]

ok, simply put all the questions, numbered in one post, and i will follow the post up with every answer =)

*edit* also just to point out, everytime something about guards is brought up the devs, or gm's immediatly say the guards are in the game and your supposed to rp they are there and there are consiquences for your actions.... so why is is so bad that a real group is doing it, to better the rp?

[lordraleigh]

WOW


ok, let me sit here and think how to respond to all these post.

hmmm, first of all everyone wants the run down on the forums, and well you will find out ingame for most of it.

as for the laws.... for one i saw something about being democratic.... is democracy real, or believable in midevil times?

Narure...... you dont trust him, yet maybe he changed his ways. before everyone starts distrusting the guild, have information of something the guild did wrong =).

i had no idea this would get so much backlash, but keep saying it cant, wont, might not work. all great people had haters.

This is the answer on whether democracy and republic ideas are possible or not:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy#Middle_Ages

During the Middle Ages, there were various systems involving elections or assemblies, although often only involving a minority of the population

Of course Planeshift Setting is Fantasy, and does not need to reflect accuratedly the real world historical middle ages.

[Sangwa]

*edit* also just to point out, everytime something about guards is brought up the devs, or gm's immediatly say the guards are in the game and your supposed to rp they are there and there are consiquences for your actions.... so why is is so bad that a real group is doing it, to better the rp?

I believe the concern of the devs is the following: "power abuse." They'd rather not trust anyone with the power of watching over Hydlaa's citizens, unless they trust them/form them/control them themselves.

You say your guild hasn't done anything wrong. It has done something already. You've got a criminal that will be working as a guard. That's not right. Obviously. Remarks such as "give him a second chance" make no sense in a Law enforcement guild. Will you guys be giving second chances to murderers, pick pockets and such? Come on.

Your guild's supposed task is to serve the people and that includes us all. You shouldn't be surprised at our reactions, since we're criticizing this thing that's supposed to help our characters. It makes all sense that we try to ask for it to be clearer from corruption and low standards.
I've mentioned my dislikes before, and think I've been overly clear in pointing out my reasons for holding such feelings.

[sstoykaa]

Great minds, eh?

But seriously. Why would anyone support someone that want to impose various laws and run for governmental position without even knowing said person's policies?

dude you need to relax, you act like im trying to take over the city. and you want all of you want answers in the forums about everything. i have started out as small as i can. i go around and talk to people about my ideas and plans. one by one, sometimes in groups. i never asked for your support on this forums. i have yet to enforce any laws. i have done nothing but try to recruit people and this is what i get. instead of whining why dont you wait to meet stoyka in game.... sangwa and stoyka had a nice talk last night, and i guarantee his thoughts changed on the whole matter. so give it a chance instead of just freaking out. the law enforcemnt aint even close to being ready to patrol the streets.

[ThomPhoenix]

If you think that an organization making laws, enforcing those laws and deciding about punishment (normally divided over separate organizations) is  something people don't need to worry about, you're wrong. Especially when that organization calls itself "official" while they're not. And when the apparent representative of said organization is too lazy to quickly read through 3 pages of replies to answer the few questions people have, then it's not odd at all that people have serious reservations. And again, getting Narure involved is ... silly.

Just a slight hint

[Sangwa]

Sstoykaa, posting in the forums is asking for opinion. If you didn't want people to give their two cents but instead work slowly towards your end, then you shouldn't have posted this here. Our "whinning" consists in critiques, well applied and targeted that you should either ignore or attempt to respond.
You shouldn't ever complaint, as we're sorta of doing you a favor you've asked.

And true. Our conversation lead me to think you have good potential. But if you don't listen to anyone, you're not going to live up to it.

[Zan]

The PS community is overly uptight about things like this ... people play for fun and being told what to do, even if it is with the best intentions, isn't fun for most of them. Especially if it's being told what to do by someone they don't acknowledge as their superior. I do think people need to lighten up about this but I also have to say that you've started this thing off in a very bad way. I don't doubt your good intentions, that's not my place to doubt but I do have issues with your approach.

A good idea is easier accepted if it is presented with as much information as possible. The main reason why you're getting such a big backlash on a not so bad idea is because you started with "Ah I want to create a guard unit for roleplaying purposes, lets make a post about it!". A much better approach would have been "Ah I ant to create a guard unit for roleplaying purposes, lets think real hard about it, write it out as detailed as possible, ask help from those who have tried it and check if it can work within the settings ... then when I have all that I'll make it public and make a post about it." I know that both can be frustrating .. the former because of the obvious reasons we witness in this thread. The latter because after all that hard work it could be that you hardly get any attention and practically no people interested in joining your guild. This last is something that many good guild ideas have to struggle with .. but personally I'd rather struggle with that and at least have the acceptance of the community than the other way around.

Then your second problem is a completely in character one, hiring Narure and making him your frontman. He is commonly known as an Outlaw and a thug in the game, not one self-respecting character with half a mind will allow such a person to read him his rights. I've talked to Narure both in and out of character, in-character I basically laughed at his attempt to claim he bettered his life and was now serving the law .. out of character I understood that he wanted to go a different way and figured it would be interesting to become one of the good guys now. Truth be told, Narure can only be succesful in his new role and not bring shame and distrust to your guild if the RP is bad. As long as we look at him through our character's eyes, those that know him ... well a criminal will always be a criminal in real life too. Even after they have been punished and spent a lot of time in jail reforming, people won't trust them. Narure hasn't even been punished for his previous acts.

Then again he could be playing everyone and him being one of the good guys could be an intentional trick to infiltrate your guild. I've had my law enforcement guild being infiltrated by one of the Outlaws, I've actually made your mistake so I know what I'm talking about. My decency towards the player and my desire to have good roleplayers made me trust him. I can't directly say that something like this is bad roleplaying but I will say that it is very unrespectful roleplaying. You trust a player behind the characters only to find out that they abused your OOC trust to accomplish IC things.

[Sangwa]

They're opinions, not demands. If mine, or any other player's, succint attempts at expressing our ideas sound uptight, then it is because the person listening must be taking them defensively right from the start. And that's not such a big deal, as most of us will ignore incoherent retaliations. It would be alot worst if we would have to fake our true thoughts with needless nicety and dishonest sympathy.
In fact, I believe the PS Community is better than it has ever been, as I haven't noticed much babbling of late in forums where babbling shouldn't exist. Such as this one. Lately the discussions I witness are usually positive, even if heated, contributing with good thought material. My congratulations to all of you, while I'm at it.

And Zan, what you mentioned was basicly what myself, and some others, have been claiming as well: Take your time creating the guild, earn reputation, values and method; don't expect people to trust you when you have Narure. Some of us would also add, in a kind or harsh way, depending on the person's personaility, "You should change the name as the current one sounds too big headed and official when it's not."

[sstoykaa]

Haha!

And when the apparent representative of said organization is too lazy to quickly read through 3 pages of replies to answer the few questions people have, then it's not odd at all that people have serious reservations.

bringing ooc feelings ic....... smooth move.


also, not one of my guards have tried to enforce any law. we are simply in the starting phase. everyones so worried about having laws put on them that they dont want, yet no laws have been placed. we are simply at he recruiting phase, since, so many good warriors would "love to help" but they wont leave their guild so simply our only choice is to recruit newcomers. having an idea of what the guild will be, before it does anything, because of past, ooc forum feelings, is a horrible way to go about this. just give it a chance thats all i ask, let things happen before you complain about them. its the only way to be open minded about it

[Parallo]

The serious reservations are IC as well as OOC. The fact that you won't read shows that, outside of the PS world at least, you are unorganised. I would have reservations about such an organisation myself.