Author Topic: Evil.  (Read 5169 times)

zanzibar

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2007, 10:00:57 am »
You say that like you think I did not know that.  I sugested "James Bond evil" because I personally find the Bard to dark for my tastes.  I am not suggesting that you could not rp an assasin via Shakespeare.  But for my self, evil is best, when it puts the giant self destruct button on the front of the control panel of the death ray cannon.

Putting a minion in a decompression tank and cranking it until his eyeballs explode isn't dark?
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derwoodly

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #16 on: January 25, 2007, 10:12:40 am »
If your thinking of the James Bond with Timothy Dalton, I believe his head exploded not his eyeballs, and compaired to a tragedy like Romeo and Juliet, yes.

zanzibar

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2007, 10:19:37 am »
If your thinking of the James Bond with Timothy Dalton, I believe his head exploded not his eyeballs, and compaired to a tragedy like Romeo and Juliet, yes.


Romeo and Juliet weren't dark.  They were just emo and lacked parental supervision.
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derwoodly

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2007, 10:25:47 am »

Romeo and Juliet weren't dark.  They were just emo and lacked parental supervision.
[/quote]

And Hamlet was not dark either, his family was codependant in a medieval sort of way.

zanzibar

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2007, 10:35:02 am »
And Hamlet was not dark either, his family was codependant in a medieval sort of way.

Hamlet was different because they were adults and therefore had real emotions.  Romeo was just all like "OMG UR HOT!" to every girl he saw.  Mercutio was on E all the time, and Juliet should have known better than to fall for a bad boy.  R&J is still better than A Midsummer's Night Dream though.  MSND was basically a drunken slumber party with a bunch of horny 15 year olds in the middle of the woods.
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derwoodly

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2007, 10:43:14 am »
I never read Midsummer's night dream.  Ill have to take your word on that one.  In R&J I remember it a bit different, but I always had a bit of trouble with the old english verbage, maybe I missed something. 

Goodnight Zanz.

zanzibar

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2007, 10:45:30 am »
I never read Midsummer's night dream.  Ill have to take your word on that one.  In R&J I remember it a bit different, but I always had a bit of trouble with the old english verbage, maybe I missed something. 

Goodnight Zanz.


Middle English.  You wouldn't be able to read actual Old English.
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emeraldfool

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #22 on: January 25, 2007, 01:43:34 pm »
Romeo and Juliet weren't dark.  They were just emo and lacked parental supervision.

evil is best, when it puts the giant self destruct button on the front of the control panel of the death ray cannon.

Lol, lotsa funny quotes in this thread ;)


So basically what you're saying, Zanzi, is that evil shouldn't be toned down for RPs because everyone's smart enough to not be disturbed by it, yet it doesn't matter because most don't RP evil properly anyway (i.e. RP 'Shakespearian evil')?

And what you're saying, Derwood, is that we should tip-toe around the darkest stuff to avoid injuring someone's innocence?

I'm not saying anything, I'm just trying to figure out the general consensus...

zanzibar

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #23 on: January 25, 2007, 01:49:40 pm »
So basically what you're saying, Zanzi, is that evil shouldn't be toned down for RPs because everyone's smart enough to not be disturbed by it, yet it doesn't matter because most don't RP evil properly anyway (i.e. RP 'Shakespearian evil')?

That's not even slightly what I'm saying.

Shakespearian evil and Tolkienesque evil are not simply toned down real world evil.

It's entirely proper to RP evil in a Shakespearian style.

A lot of people in game do a good job of RPing evil.

Playing a rapist and doing a realistic job of it in the game is NOT ok.  It violates quite a few of the rules, it's rude and mean spiritted, it's hazardous, it's potentially triggering to certain players, it's just a plain bad idea.
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emeraldfool

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #24 on: January 25, 2007, 02:28:29 pm »
So basically what you're saying, Zanzi, is that evil shouldn't be toned down for RPs because everyone's smart enough to not be disturbed by it, yet it doesn't matter because most don't RP evil properly anyway (i.e. RP 'Shakespearian evil')?

That's not even slightly what I'm saying.

Shakespearian evil and Tolkienesque evil are not simply toned down real world evil.

It's entirely proper to RP evil in a Shakespearian style.

A lot of people in game do a good job of RPing evil.

Playing a rapist and doing a realistic job of it in the game is NOT ok.  It violates quite a few of the rules, it's rude and mean spiritted, it's hazardous, it's potentially triggering to certain players, it's just a plain bad idea.


But you admit that Shakespearian and Tolienesque evil is substantially more toned down than "doing a realistic job", by saying that real-world evil is "hazardous, mean-spirited and a bad idea", but the other stuff isn't.

And when I say 'properly' I don't mean that it's bad RP, I mean that it doesn't actually reflect 'proper evil' - proper evil where when somebody rapes somebody else, they get HIV and die slowly. That's evil, not this nice clean 'duelling to the death' that goes on.

The thing about Shakespearian evil is that it's not real. I'm just wondering if we can really expect to create a world that lacks a shadow. It's indeniable that darkness like this is inherent in any real society - you might even say that without evil to make people seek each other out for safety, there would be no society, or at least not one recognisable to us. And PS lacks that edge. But is that a good thing, or a bad thing?

ThomPhoenix

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #25 on: January 25, 2007, 02:44:30 pm »
Planeshift is not real, so get over that.
The evil to use in RPs is Shakespeare- and Tolkien-like.
If anyone tries to RP evil "more real", like raping, they're going to get banned.
It has happened before and it will happen again.

And if you think that's restrictive, it's not. Just use your head, this is a game you know.
We're not evil. We're simply amazing.

emeraldfool

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #26 on: January 25, 2007, 03:19:19 pm »
Planeshift is not real, so get over that.
The evil to use in RPs is Shakespeare- and Tolkien-like.
If anyone tries to RP evil "more real", like raping, they're going to get banned.
It has happened before and it will happen again.

And if you think that's restrictive, it's not. Just use your head, this is a game you know.

I'm not talking about Planeshift, I'm talking about RPs in general, and I'm talking about the morals of realistic rping vs. emulating evil, not whether or not it's against the rules...

How many times to I gotta say that? :P

zanzibar

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #27 on: January 25, 2007, 04:54:06 pm »
But you admit that Shakespearian and Tolienesque evil is substantially more toned down than "doing a realistic job", by saying that real-world evil is "hazardous, mean-spirited and a bad idea", but the other stuff isn't.

Shakespearian and Tolkienesque evil is not toned down - it's fundamentally different.

Shakespearian has shadow enough for anyone.  It's both surreal and superreal at the same time.
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emeraldfool

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #28 on: January 25, 2007, 07:45:30 pm »
But you admit that Shakespearian and Tolienesque evil is substantially more toned down than "doing a realistic job", by saying that real-world evil is "hazardous, mean-spirited and a bad idea", but the other stuff isn't.

Shakespearian and Tolkienesque evil is not toned down - it's fundamentally different.

Shakespearian has shadow enough for anyone.  It's both surreal and superreal at the same time.

So... your saying that Shakespearian evil is just as bad as brutal real-life rapings and such, but in a different way?

I don't follow... I've never been that disturbed by anything in Shakespeare...
At least not as much as when reading 'A Clockwork Orange'.

lordraleigh

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Re: Evil.
« Reply #29 on: January 25, 2007, 07:57:47 pm »
Well here are more examples of Evil(both in ideas and in actions) that do not necessarily involve rape and alike and are truly medieval:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medieval_Inquisition

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch_trials

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malleus_Maleficarum

And another example, although not very fitting with the world of Yliakum:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust

There is no "Evil" literally. The problem is that something called lust for power is what drives mankind history throughout the centuries.
And as was said many times: "Power corrupts, Absolute power corrupts absolutely" and the end of achieving and maintaining power is many times done through the use of several unethical means. The basic nature of what is called Evil is the hunger for power, over others, over land, or over everything. That can be the basic concept for the Evil in Planeshift that is not exclusively Shakespearian or Tolkienesque, as in the struggle for power, things like slaughters, torture, oppression, genocide among others even worse were common, and still are common. Of course madness, ignorance and hatred together with power lead to other levels of brutality as well, like in the Witch Hunts and Inquisition.

P.S.: Here is a excellent phrase to express this:

Quote from: Nineteen Eighty-Four
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face— forever.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2007, 09:15:58 pm by lordraleigh »