The Winch -- What are they thinking?

[Roahn]

I'd like to ask, what is going on with The Winch? Here's the situation: The only way to get to a new map, called "The Winch," is to do what I hesitantly call a "quest." This quest requires talking to a certain NPC. Unfortunately someone decided that the NPC should only give the quest every 15 minutes or so... So there is constantly a crowd around this certain NPC. A few minutes ago, there were a dozen people standing around, typing "Can I help you?" to the same NPC over and over and over again. I spent an hour last night, when there were only 3 of us, and never got the "quest." Today, with a dozen people doing the same thing, I started asking around. One guy said he spent 3 solid hours yesterday, and he's back today, and still hasn't gotten "The Quest."

Now, I hate to whine about a "free pre-alpha" game, but this just baffles me. This NPC is so stupid, he doesn't even understand you when you say "Hello" to him! I've been playing for over a year, and even the day I started, you could at least say "Hello" and get a response better than "Please use a correct phrase." The idea of standing in front of an NPC and asking the same question 10,000 times in a row is just ridiculous, and reminds me yet again why I hadn't done a "quest" in months. I begin to wonder if it would be possible to make a game less interesting.

-Roahn

[Ryiel Fohpaws]

I've been told that there is a lockout for each quest that lasts from a few minutes up to a month. I'm going to try it again in march

[bilbous]

I have to say this sounds like something needs to be done. Perhaps there is another entrance that can be opened by a suitably leveled lock-pick, I haven't looked too hard but I haven't yet found the lock that was supposedly added. Perhaps it is in the Winch heheh. Guess I'll wait a month of so before I try to go there. BTW do you have to talk to the guy every time you want to enter the Winch or is it a one time deal?

[Parallo]

Is it not obvious what they are thinking? They make a new area thats supposedly only for a select few that are permitted to enter. If it was wide open the place would have been totally packed. That would have been ludacriously against what the settings say about it. Lets face it, if they included a new field in an update everyone would be there. There is no other way to slowly distribute access.

[Caarrie]

Please remember not all quests you can get by just asking there are other quests you need to do before getting certain ones. So it could just be you have not done the quest(s) needed before you can get this one or others.

[Roahn]

Please remember not all quests you can get by just asking there are other quests you need to do before getting certain ones. So it could just be you have not done the quest(s) needed before you can get this one or others.

I have already done the Helm quest from the same NPC long ago. If there was a prerequisite quest, it would be nice if the NPC would say something about it, other than "I have nothing for you at this time."

The people that have done this quest basically just stood there asking over and over until it finally gave it to them. Time and repeating the same question thousands of times was how they finally got the quest.

-Roahn

[bilbous]

Perhaps that is true Parallo but realistically there would be more than one entrance, thieves would get in by going over (or under) the walls, up the sewers etc. Has anybody looked to see if the sewers were extended? I know I haven't, nor did I make it down to where the named rogue under the temple sits to see if the passage has been extended behind him yet (fell off the durned ladder just past the thugs).

[miadon]

Perhaps that is true Parallo but realistically there would be more than one entrance, thieves would get in by going over (or under) the walls, up the sewers etc.

I havn't done the quest so don't know what it involves.

I would also assume that players who roleplay merchants would be given access to winch areas.

[Parallo]

I can inform you that no, we are'nt. It'd be nice if we were though.

[bilbous]

I suppose you could always try to bribe a high level mage (GM) to teleport you in but I don't think it would work....I still don't see anywhere where it says that is the only way in, entrance was said to be "tricksy" which is suitably vague as to allow for it to not be singular. Indeed the inclusion of the s in that term does suggest more than one trick, of course there is only one legal way....and of course I am just talking through my hat. Nice hat by the way.

[Ryiel Fohpaws]

I checked the sewers and the laanx temple. Perhaps I'm unlucky but I've found no entrance to the winch... 

[bilbous]

Zak might have a new quest...dunno though. Just saw some enkidukai talking to him. There is that platform across from the temple dungeon exit that could theoretically lead somewhere. It may be that any second entrance is not implemented, it is hard to believe there will only ever be one way in.

[backeroo]

IIf it was wide open the place would have been totally packed.

You mean, like the Bronze Door Area?

[drah]

I enjoy doing the quests... and I appreciate the hard work and thought that has gone into some of them.

I'm not advocating PURE multiple-choice... but I think, for quests... if there are certain phrases to use, we could do with them being options for us... rather than a guessing game on the exact phrase/context/grammar/etc to us.

At present:

- some quests require you to provide the full name of the NPC who sent you, while others don't... to anyone unaware of this... and who have gotten used to the format of phrases used in the majority of quests.... it will lead to frustrated players, it is inevitable.

- many quests require "about [keyword]" to be used... this seemed to be standard for a while... NOW it appears some responses will NOT be triggered if the word "about" is prefixed before the keyword.

- Sometimes a grammatically correct sentence works ONLY... other times a grammatically incorrect sentence works ONLY.

- Saying "tell about [keyword]" to an NPC triggers a response... this is more a command (like picking an item from a multiple-choice list of responses) than it is dialog... and again causes even more confusion to the NPC dialog system.

^^ That said, I also like the freedom to ask about things and be surprised by the hidden information NPCs have if you probe them with questions.

I think for pivotal phrases... especially mid-quest... it'd be nice to have the key-phrases as options... but not necessarily to replace the freeform dialog that exists.

(I'm just trying to think of how to fix what many perceive as a problem in this part of the game mechanics... whilst not taking away something other people may like, such as the freeform dialog.

Anyway... for me, it's not a big issue... eventually someone finds out the answer... and when they do it's usually not long before I learn about it... I'm merely just suggesting something that may smooth out some rough edges in the NPC dialog system.

More importantly, and more on-topic... I was under the impression the lock-out times for quests only applied on a per-person basis.  From what I understand here.. these can now apply to everyone as a whole... which would seem to give the potential for a lot of annoyance when a new quest arrives... surely the system doesn't work like this?

@bilbous there are at least 3 quests that involve him, maybe they were talking to them in relation to those quests?? (They all start at different NPCs though... and they all tell you to go see him.. so I'm not spoiling anything!)

[bilbous]

Indubitably, she mentioned a particular circumstance there is no need to go into. I was just speculating that there might be an underworld way in and that he could possibly be involved if there were. The only time I got him to deal with me he took something I think I needed elsewhere, the blighter! Never did finish that quest....getting off topic sorry.

Wouldn't it be awesome if there was some obscure rooftop pathway you could take to get into the winch?