Author Topic: Contribution Discussion  (Read 17810 times)

Karyuu

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #15 on: April 30, 2007, 07:00:23 pm »
Just a note of warning to everyone: if you fail to follow the rules I have mentioned, I will be deleting your entry. I've laid a lot of effort into putting this together for you, so the least you can do is read the instructions and make sure your entry fits all guidelines. If you're having trouble, start up another thread and ask for help and advice there. The official thread is for final work, not work in progress. Please be respectful of the rules :)
Judge: Are you trying to show contempt for this court, Mr Smith?
Smith: No, My Lord. I am attempting to conceal it.

Cherppow

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2007, 05:21:09 pm »
Hi,

Ah, the brave first contributors!

To LigH: Quite nice! Hmm, where have I seen this symbol... in podium walls perhaps. I'm not sure which is meant here, "polishing" or "polished". Karyuu or Xillix, you know more?

To Proglin: Interesting, I like the damage on the side there. The textures should be integrated into one image though. Each image requires one rendering pass from CS, so we should keep the number of images as low as possible.


Karyuu gave pretty good info in the main thread how to do required things in 3Ds Max. I'll fill in how these can be done in Blender, as I think many of you don't have the more expensive cousin.


Modeling

Quote from: Karyuu
To get an accurate poly count for models intended to be used in games in 3ds Max, for example, you must convert the model to an editable mesh before using the polygon counter. This is because the game engine will view the model in the same way, ie. with triangular faces.

In Blender you can see current face (=polygon) count in the header of the user preferences window. It's found in the top of Blender screen by default. Note that in object mode it shows the total number of faces in current scene. While in edit mode, it shows the faces of the current object (along with other info).


The three pairs of numbers are vertices, edges and faces. First value shows currently selected, and the latter shows the total number. To us the important number is total faces, which is 52 for this model.

Like Karyuu said, faces need to be in triangles, so convert them with ctrl+t in editmode. Afterwards check that triangles are oriented the way you want. If not, you can flip a pair with ctrl+f in editmode. This can have great effect in how lights are calculated on the object.


UVs and textures

Quote from: Karyuu
You will need to export and show a colored UV map (example here) so that we see the texture is laid out correctly. Textures themselves for these simple models shouldn’t exceed 128x128. Export your textures as a .PNG, but always keep your original working files – whether they are Photoshop’s .PSD or something else. We don’t use bump or spec or normal mapping (yet!) so all we need is the base texture alone. The texture .PNG will need to be presented with the UV.

I don't think Blender has built in script for coloured UV maps. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.) There used to be a script called UVpainter, but I couldn't find it in the new version of Blender. So, we'll have to do two layouts and join them. The normal UV layout can be created in UV/Image editor header: UVs-Scripts-Save UV Face Layout. Note that you need to be in UV Face select mode for the menu to appear.

 For the colours we can use Bake Render function. Create a new image of same size as your UV map, and assign it to your model. Then select your model and "bake render normals" from User preferences header: Render - Bake Render Meshes - Normals. Save this new texture from UV/Image Editor and merge it with the UV face layout image in a paint soft.

Simple Blender UV mapping guides: http://www.blender.org/development/release-logs/blender-242/uv-unwrapping/


Inventory Icons

Quote from: Karyuu
If you have the model and the texture, creating the icon is a piece of cake. Render your object, perhaps with some lights in the scene if the default light is not enough, then take the image into a graphic editor and to some work. If your 3D application is able to let you see an alpha channel from the render, that’s perfect. Save them both, isolate your object in GIMP or Photoshop using that alpha (get rid of the render background), then apply a soft black outer glow and you are done. The icons need to be 64x64 pixels, so make sure that glow doesn’t get cut off at the edges.

In Blender you can view the alpha by pressing a-key in the render window. Copy both the normal render and the alpha into GIMP and copy-paste the alpha image into the mask of the colour render. Use "Apply layer mask" to convert the mask into actual alpha channel. Same alpha can be used to create the black outer glow, by using Alpha to selection and Stroke Selection functions. But you can use what you feel most comfortable with.


Presentation Screenshots

Quote from: Karyuu
Since you’re not going to upload the models themselves for us to see, you’ll have to let screenshots do the job. Have a couple of orthographic views (top, left, front, etc.) and then one or two in a perspective. These need to show the textured object. In addition, you will need to show a screenshot of the wireframe. If working with 3ds max, you can find one tutorial on presentation-worthy wireframe rendering here, and another here. I use the second method for my own work, but the choice is yours among many. Use what works best for you, as long as it looks good. Keep the screenshots fairly small, no need to go above 500x500 pixels to show a single view.

Like you probably know, Orthographic view in Blender is accessed with numpad 5 and directions with numpad 7,1 and 3. Snap the camera to your current viewpoint with ctrl+alt+ins, and render with F12.

For the wireframe render, go into material buttons panel and click "wire" under Render and pipeline. Also click the "shadeless" button under material tab, to disable shadows and highlights on the wireframe. This will make the grid more clear and easier to fathom. Choose colour of the wireframe by clicking the box next to "col" button. I also recommend enabling "ztransp" and "full osa" for better visuals when objects overlap.


If you want to go for the jagged edge, oldschool look, find your way into Scene-Render buttons panel and disable oversampling "OSA".


*edit*

Please remember to check that you have all the needed pieces when making a commit.

Quote from: Karyuu
Submissions must include 1) the total triangle count of the object, 2) UV map+texture, 3) ready inventory icon, 4) several screenshots of the item itself, in various views, with at least a couple of them showing the wireframe. You can’t submit an inventory icon separately, or a model separately – it doesn’t make much sense to have these broken up and consistency between the objects is likely to break if people work on them separately.

An example commit:
(I don't want to spoil your fun, so I did an item outside the list.)

Contributor(s): Cherppow
Item: Old helm
Triangle count: 300 tri
Texture size: 128 x 128 px

Inventory icon:


UV map and texture images:


Screenshots:



Ok, that's about all I can think of. Have fun. :)
« Last Edit: May 03, 2007, 04:18:15 pm by Cherppow »

Karyuu

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2007, 05:28:44 pm »
Cherppow, your aid and suggestions are always a much-welcomed treat! :) Thanks a lot for taking the time to write this out.
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Smith: No, My Lord. I am attempting to conceal it.

LigH

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2007, 09:08:04 pm »
The artwork on the cloth? -- Stand on the well down into the dungeons, and look upwards to the temple ceiling.
__

Orthography is the art not to make mistakes in written sentences.

A display with equal distances along ordinates, and no perspective distortion (projection from infinity), is orthogonality.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2007, 09:14:23 pm by LigH »

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LigH

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2007, 10:14:47 pm »
@ rast:

The contract model is great: Simple and meaningful. Just the texture ... It should, IMHO, look more like handwritten text, rather than a template made of writing lines.

Your "cup" (I remember "Indiana Jones and the last crusade") I'd rather call "chalice". But the word "cup" has different meanings in online dictionaries, the geometry of a "coffee cup" may be rather modern. Well - I bet we have the chance to see both for slightly different purposes.

And for the Laanx symbol: Remember there is also a Jade version! ;)

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rast

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #20 on: May 02, 2007, 10:19:39 pm »
Thanks for the comments - I can make a jade version simply by switching the texture file - i managed to UV map the model so it would fit your origional image.

I'll give the contract texture a "makeover" at some point :)
edit: more like it?
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7058/revisedcontractnewtextuju4.png
« Last Edit: May 02, 2007, 10:44:25 pm by rast »
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Nikodemus

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2007, 12:06:33 am »
Maybe use this font: http://www.dafont.com/old-script.font instead too
You may need to make your texture more detailed too, as with this level of detail any text may be pointless anyway.
I didn't like the horizontal lines too. Made it look modern.

Edit:
whats the point of these colors: http://darkforces.jediknight.net/tutorials/skinning/pic/step1_uvmap.jpg ?
Since you can make your texture to be seamless with something else in any area of the texture, how the colors are supposed to reflect it? isn't it better to actually examine the texture with UV lines on it?
« Last Edit: May 03, 2007, 12:09:00 am by Nikodemus »



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Illysia

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #22 on: May 03, 2007, 02:01:58 am »
I didn't like the horizontal lines too. Made it look modern.

The Consistitution of the United States is handwritten and the lines are quite straight.  ;D Besides people in the past weren't as sloppy with writing as we are today and definately not sloppy with important papers.

Xordan

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2007, 02:21:04 am »
The constitution is modern :P But yeah, documents from quite a while back were pretty neat and ordered (Roman stuff for example).

LigH

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #24 on: May 03, 2007, 08:35:46 am »
If someone is looking for not roman looking writing systems, I recommend Tommy of Escondido's Alien Fonts Page.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2007, 04:03:49 pm by LigH »

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Nikodemus

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2007, 12:15:17 pm »
Illysia, you meant this one: http://www.archives.gov/education/lessons/constitution-workshop/images/Constitution_Pg1of4_AC-l.jpg ?

Anyway on your pieces of papers..... have you been trying to make the edges look like actual edges? You could use there alpha chanel too.



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Mordaan

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2007, 04:31:12 pm »
Polishing cloth -- assuming that you mean a cloth which is used to polish some items, not a cloth that is polished itself...

<= clickable

P.S.: You can also order different base colors and artworks. ;)

Good one, LigH.  But remember, its supposed to have something embroidered on it, right?   ;)
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Jeraphon

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2007, 05:14:49 pm »
Moving my comment to the right place.

Okay, on this one I know I'm not wrong. :)

Quote
As you can see, many of these items come from quests. So to really do them justice, you will probably have to be familiar with the NPCs and stories involved. I should hear no artists at all saying that they never do quests or don’t bother, etc., etc. Wink If you plan on contributing to PS, you should be familiar with all it has to offer.

If you've done the Interview Sunshine Squadron Applicants quest, looking at the three application forms would show you that they all look fundamentally different. Unfortunately, because it would be a quest spoiler I can't tell you HOW (you'd have to do it and shown by the quote above, Karyuu is backing me up) but suffice to say it looks great for Taulim's, but doesn't fit the description of Sinto's or Zak's. Mind you, when shrunk down to that size it might not be noticeable, and/or since they're quest items people really won't care about the differences. I dunno.

LigH

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2007, 05:30:25 pm »
I don't know ... possible that I did not yet get that quest. (If so - tell me next weekend in game how to get it...)

But I can make the artwork look like broidered instead of painted. Or is there a specific symbol or text expected?
__

Oops -- this is not the discussion thread! Mod: Please move the last two replies...  :-[
« Last Edit: May 03, 2007, 05:33:56 pm by LigH »

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rast

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Re: Contribution Discussion
« Reply #29 on: May 03, 2007, 11:14:12 pm »
cheers everyone for comments/advice/criticism

only a quick post - tryed with a different font and a bit of general texture edditing:


cheers all,
rast
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