Leveling and Magic

[Moniker]

Greetings

   I have read the guides (Aliva Alyeve's as well) and done my searches (magic), (magic + research), (magic + guide)
etc.

   I have a couple of questions.
1. What level in the particular way do you have to be to do the research of a "realm 1", glyph?
2. What level inteligence does one have to research a "realm 1" glyph?
3. How would one raise a magic way's level from zero to one? Will a trainer do that much for us with some tria?
    The Aliva Alyeve guide says "Realm 1: Can be cast at level one and above", what about the reasearch?

   There is a basic problem of not enough of the most basic info on this subject. The first glyph's that one encounter's
is at the magic shop. I assume these are all "realm 1" glyph's? They should be if they are not.

                                The glyph it'self should be labeled (in it's infor) as to what "realm" it is.

   My particular problem: I am just researching my very first glyph. I'm level 110 Intelligence and level 4 Crystal Way
I've bought Crystal Way training so that I'm ready for the practical points to advance to level 5. I bought the
Crystal Way glyph which is supposed to be "realm 1", according to the Aliva Alyeve guide. I can purify it, but I
can't research it ! What am I mssing, a quest to be a book or something?, higher Intelligence?, Where am I going
wrong?

                                                                  Thanks, from a rand beginner!

[ThomPhoenix]

1: 1 .
2: Only affects mana.
3: Train it with trias + progression points, after that practice the spell enough and you become level 1.
4: You need level 1 for researching. Realm two needs level 20 I think.
5: Glyphs don't have a realm. Spells have a realm!
6: Drag a Crystal Way glyph on the purification icon. There are multiple glyphs, I recommend you use the Arrow glyph. After it's purified drag it to one of the combination slots. Click on the research button, expect to click it a lot, around 20 times can be necessary. After you have researched the spell, you can cast it.

[Lanarel]

I made a post, but it was lost and now all is answered by Thom already

The only thing Thom did not mention (of course) was my idea on this failing to research. Even if you could not fail (i.e., a correct combination shows the spell), there are many combinations to test. To give an idea, I did some computations. The time needed is for if you research one combination per second (impossible already).
With one glyph in each way, there are 1956 combinations, taking you 32 minutes.
With two glyphs in each way, there are over 1.3 billion combinations, taking roughly 41 years.
With 40 glyphs (the number in the art I think), there are about 2.2*10⁴⁸ combinations, or roughly 1.5*10³¹ times the lifetime of the earth.

I would think spell research is something that would help me to find correct combinations, and not make it even more impossible to do so. For example, you could put in a number of glyphs, and depending on your level, it might reorder glyphs towards a working spell. If not, spells can only be learned from cheat sheets based on database knowledge, as even a whole guild could not find combinations by just trying.
I am sure in the future there will be other ways to learn spells, but at the moment, I think this random failing (and yes you have to click 10s of times sometimes for even basic things) does not make sense.

[Moniker]

Hey, Thanks for the help !

    ThomPhoenix, you answered a very basic question, that I haven't seen answered before! That you may
have to research multiple times before the research is completed(and take the hits!). It may be good to
reword the dialog regarding failure, so it doesn't put off new players not to keep trying( or just put a spot
in the beginners manual regarding this).
    Lanarel, Yes, I agree, if this is the process, it is rather awkward and laborious. It might be nice for thought
put into reworking, at least this part of the magic system, to replace this randomness, somewhat, or supplement
it in some way, such as to include quests, or some other nontrival task of magic learning, to do the research !

                                                                  Thanks, for all the help

[Lanarel]

    Lanarel, Yes, I agree, if this is the process, it is rather awkward and laborious. It might be nice for thought
put into reworking, at least this part of the magic system, to replace this randomness, somewhat, or supplement
it in some way, such as to include quests, or some other nontrival task of magic learning, to do the research !

I think learning combinations through quests would be nice.
Also, I find some flaw in my computations I took all possible combinations, so even those with 40 glyphs in a random order. But there are only 4 glyphs slots for research, so with 40 glyphs there are only 2 million combinations

[Josellis]

Well, I know that by doing some quests, they give you information on different things. One of them is which glyphs combine with which. For example, an NPC might give you the ABS glyph and will tell you to combine it with the CAR glyph in order to have a car with ABS... (lol)

[Moniker]

Greetings;

     I hope the car has 4WD, the roads, you know!    Maybe quests would be the wrong thought, maybe like
go to a certain library (like finding the trainer) and finding a certain book and reading about a magic incantation
or something. This still leaves the randomness, and supplements it with a little work, (and real research ! )

                                                               Thanks

[ThomPhoenix]

If you are level 200 Crystal Way it's incredibly silly that you need 40 tries to discover a basic spell like Missile. Research success should be based on your level in the Way of the spell, your Intelligence, perhaps Will and a luck factor.

[Moniker]

Greetings

   I finally found my problem, after reading again closely the instructions for researching in one of the guides
I noticed I missed a step. Putting the glyph in one of the 4 boxes provided. You can purify, but not research
if you miss this step. Below is a copy of my post regarding this to the "Wish Forum"
                           
                               I hope this helps clear things up a bit for other players


This is a minor window display request. In the Spell Combination window there are 4 boxes at the bottom
just above the buttons,(purify, research, etc) They should be outlined in a thicker line, and a more contrasting
color. The problem is for beginners, they are easy to miss, and what happens is, they drag the glyph down to
the button, to perform the desired action, which works for purify, but fails for research! To research they NEED
to be in one of those boxes. Beginners can waste a lot of time, (and become very puzzeled as to what's wrong)
because of the absence of this one minor window adjustment.

                                                   Thanks, for everyones patience and understanding !  New Player

[Lanarel]

Just to add:
There seems to be a bug at the moment, that sometimes makes you not find a spell even if you do everything correct (including researching 20 times):
http://www.hydlaa.com/bugtracker/bug.php?op=show&bugid=2249&pos=5