Using ooc knowlege ingame

[Mordraugion]

Its rather worrying the players have a better idea of what's going on than the GMs.

I didn't actually say that :p just on those two occasions

[Allive]

to be honest i knew of the silverweave/iron slash reduction for a good month before it happend i didnt exactly know when it was going to happen till about a week before it did but teven then it was only a very soon but i knew of it comeing and they would be reduced for a good month before hand.

[zanzibar]

Related to the topic http://hydlaa.com/smf/index.php?topic=28776.msg332039#msg332039

What I like to complain about: It is not fair if some players use their knowledge they have from talking to GM`s or other people who are involved in game development.

What do I mean? Two examples:

1. A char sold it's silverweave or iron weapon only one hour before the slash decreased. The char even pressed to the buyer to buy the weapon now and not to wait longer.

2. A char who got chainmail gloves and boots as a reward from a GM event sold this items for a huge amount of tria only one day before everybody can buy this from a NPC merchant for much less money.

I would call this cheating because the player used information it had ooc for it's own advantage and for the disadvantage of an other player. Of course you cannot roleplay your char without ooc knowledge. That`s not the point I argue about. But you should not use so special issues depending to the development of the game ingame. That belongs not to RP and a fair exposure to each other at a ooc level.

I ask myself why does some people already know about changes that will happen ingame. If nobody would know this before nobody could sell another a pup by means of it's ooc knowledge.

If they find a sucker and make some money without breaking any rules, power to them.  We all knew that silverweave weapons were bugged, therefore you buy them at your own risk.  We all knew that armor would be available from NPCs in the future, so if you overpay for them then you do so by your own choosing.  You have nothing to complain about.

[Aerianna Kzin]

The same is considered to be if somebody channels an ALT as a secret agent in another guild to use information with his or her main char, maybe in a guild war.

Discuss, please! I am curious about your opinions.

I have heard someone explain it as they do that as a disguise, because you can't just change your name and apperance in the game like you could in rl. It's like putting on a wig and a fake moustach. 

[zanzibar]

I don't see any problem with alts.  Spies are spies.  You should check someone's background before inviting them into your guild and sharing sensitive information with them.

People get upity when it comes to alts because they don't like things they can't control.  I hate to break it to you, but that's life.

[Illyria]

* Illyria nods "I still see 'name catchers' as a bigger danger for PS. Everybody knows the 'I have connections' excuse is BS (especially when you've never ever told anyone your name)"

[Zan]

The problems with alts as spies is that it's impossible to find out, unlike when some character would actually use a disguise or hire help to spy on someone. In those latter cases there is still a chance to see through the disguise, catch the person removing their disguise or find out about any meetings they may have with their contractors.

When you use alts none of this occurs, it not only removes all outside control but all outside chances of influencing your plot in the least. I am fully against using alts as spies and sharing knowledge between characters without any IC contact between them .. it is very bad roleplaying and unfair towards others. Whether life is fair or not is neither a good argument nor a point in the defense of this happening

[zanzibar]

* Illyria nods "I still see 'name catchers' as a bigger danger for PS. Everybody knows the 'I have connections' excuse is BS (especially when you've never ever told anyone your name)"

Please elaborate on the "I have connections" excuse.  What is it an excuse for?

The problems with alts as spies is that it's impossible to find out...

Not if it's beeing roleplayed well.

When you use alts none of this occurs, it not only removes all outside control but all outside chances of influencing your plot in the least. I am fully against using alts as spies and sharing knowledge between characters without any IC contact between them .. it is very bad roleplaying and unfair towards others.

It's borderline, but I see no reason to ban it.  Typically, alt spies are after OOC information anyway.

[Illyria]

Well example about the 'I have connections excuse' This really happend but I've changed the names (except for mine):

(20:55:30) dude says: ah you're Illyria
(20:55:53) dude looks at Illyria's facial features
(20:55:58) Illyria says: [WOTOOOT !? ARGH YOU FREAKING CAN'T READ NAE MTAGS! ARGH!!}
(20:56:16) dudette1 says: [ D: arg! *hides* ]
(20:56:23) dude says: [ no I know....Merivo gets information from places ]
(20:56:31) dudette2 tells you: [nice, that bugs the heck out of me too]
(20:56:51) Illyria says: [he can't nobody know her name that's freaking BS RP >_< &^(*$#&(*$@#&(*]
(20:57:12) dude says: [ oh....]
(20:57:13) dudette1 says: [ calm down.. ]

I believe this was the last time it happened, the last of many  Let us pray it the last last.
  and I know, I was angry! But I've told no one my name  I always introduce myself (thanks to Doria) as "I. bluehair"

[zanzibar]

Yeah, that conversation sucked.  You shouldn't ruin things by going OOC.  Next time, maybe try it like this...

(20:55:53) dude looks at Illyria's facial features
(20:55:30) dude says: ah you're Illyria
(20:55:58) Illyria says with surprise, "How do you know my name?  No one knows my name."
(20:56:16) dudette1 says: Merivo told it to me.
(20:56:51) Illyria says: Impossible.  I've told it to no one.


This is the best thing you can do.  However, you must accept that it is incredibly unfair for you to expect others to ignore your nametag, and if people call you by name, you have very little to stand on if you choose to become upity.

[Illyria]

I'm not saying to ignore my name tag (how else can somebody recognize someone else) But it's OOC use.
and your suggestion would make it so that people just randomly guess her name  and Illyria would never give into that it's her name so she can't use it anyway (but you didn't know that )

The way I see it, is that it's a small form of God RPing (pretending to have knowledge you don't have, kinda the same as doing something you can't do ) and mostly the only way to deal with God Rp is ignore it, correct it (oocly) or try to correct it ICly (which is far more difficult)
Though i have to say, normally I don't react that aggravated 
and BTW it was Dude who knew my name all of a sudden dudette1 probably got scared by me reaction

[Duraza]

Using name tags as a way to find out someones name is completely OOC yes. However isn't it strange that you feel no one would know your name? Even if its your first time playing you did not just "appear" from nowhere. Because of this its simple for someone to rp having heard your name before. Is it still wrong to use OOC name tags inorder to say you know someones name? Of course but if the person gives an IC reason for knowing it then just let it go. Who knows, they might have actually learned your name before and even saw a picture   

[Illyria]

Who knows, they might have actually learned your name before and even saw a picture   

That might be in other cases (though it's highly doubtful in all of them) But IF someone learned her name (as far as I know there are no camera's a description can, but still no name ) It has to be from a OOC source, no matter what secret shady intel organizations that person has been to, it still is OOC knowledge.

And I think this problem is that people tent to use 'alts' as spy, It's really hard to give out another name then what your name tag says

[bilbous]

You could just use your 'stage name' as your character name and keep your real name secret but I am not sure how that would help.

[Mornox]

Consider the possibility that an unknown person using your name in game is simply working within the limitations imposed by the interface.

If we were standing in a roomful of people and I looked in your eyes, and said, "Your shoe is coming apart."  Only one person would look down at his or her own feet.  A few others in the room might look down at the subject's feet, too, just out of curiosity.  The point is, without saying your name, I can convey immediately which person I'm speaking to here in Meatspace.  We don't have this most elementary and primal mode of communication in Planeshift.  It takes only a moment to meet someone's eyes, and change your facial expression to something that makes it obvious you're about to speak; it takes much longer to type it in.  Because of this, I, for one, use a basic shorthand:  The tag identifies each person individually just as if I were meeting your eyes.

Of course I don't know your name; we haven't been introduced.  All I have is a "tag" which allows me to look you in the face when I speak to you, in a manner that is obvious to you and to anyone else present.

Using the tag is simply one method for dealing with this particular limitation of the game interface vs. live interaction.