Author Topic: Race Traits  (Read 1177 times)

Duraza

  • Hydlaa Notable
  • *
  • Posts: 761
    • View Profile
    • Want to know the truth now?
Race Traits
« on: June 04, 2007, 05:43:32 pm »
I was thinking before about the magic system in place and the game history. Right now we use glyphs to cast all magic. According to the history there was an alternative type of magic. It was "raw magic" (that was gifted to Galeran by Laanx). This brought up the question of alternative magics besides that of the glyph. More importantly it made be think about the actual races and the worlds they were said to have lived on before Yliakum. My assumption is that when they were on these worlds they would not have been without magic. The form they used just would have been different from what Laanx and Talad brought to the world.

My idea is that races could use a certain magical traits that no other race would posses. Since each race is going to have a city (they still are right?) a "special trainer" could be located in their city. Inorder to gain the trainers trust you would first have to gain the trust of the race of that city. After that you would have to do whatever task(s) the trainer would say before he/she would be willing to train you. You would have to be the required race to learn whatever skill the trainer would offer or else it would just be wasted time. Actual specific skills would go along with the background history of the race and because not all races were from a different world they all might not have special magics or maybe they would have a gainable trait different from the rest.

Since this game is supposed to be realistic its not very belivable that just because your race can do a special kind of magic that everyone can. Possibly the characters ability to use their races magic could be decided during the character creation. It would gage not only if they could do the magic but their limitations at it.

Not all magic is "good" and just accepted. I would think the same about these special magics. Possibly there were special spells forrbidden in the different races home worlds and still banned here but accesible through secret quests that can also be unlocked in the races city. It might even make more sense if the person teaching these forrbidden powers was located outisde the city or in another to keep herself/himself hidden from his/her race.

Since it is a special magic it should have some sort of cost instead of mana like regular spells. Whether its forbidden or not having a dangerous cost could add to fear in using the spell at all. That way just because you recieve a powerful ability doesn't mean your going to go around killing everyone because you lose something everytime you use it. The cost should not be something as high as death (for the fact that once DR is completed it will be much harder to get out of and then there would be no point in getting the spell) but close enough to make people not want to use it unless its absolutly needed. A kind of last resort spell.

Remember this spell would go along with the specific races traits. As simple as a spell to further increase the already heightened senses of an Enkidukai (to kind of make their agility exceed its normal limits) or temporarily double a krans strength. Or the spells can be as complex as you like.
Saggi Lezeheso, The Whisper's Jest
Demoik and Rioqura, The Immortal Harrow
Vertum, Will of Dakkru

Duraza Darkom, Slayer of Kittens

Feline Prince

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 260
  • Now you see me...
    • View Profile
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2007, 12:00:41 pm »
It seems to me that "raw" magic is refined to the gods, its just Laanx was a little miffed at the time and wanted to help HER followers out. But only taught one of them who was equally selfish as her as it seems he didn't pass the talent on.
Hide where they expect you to... Its what they least expect.

Duraza

  • Hydlaa Notable
  • *
  • Posts: 761
    • View Profile
    • Want to know the truth now?
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2007, 07:26:58 pm »
Well the idea I was proposing was just an alternate form of magic not nessicarrily the "raw" magic.

The only real reason I came up with this idea is because I think there should be other forms of magic besides just glyphs. While I like the glyphs and think the story behind them is unique I think they should , instead of being objects obtainable by everyone, be rare spell items. The fact is when I think of the 6 ways and I think of training them by using glyphs it doesn't make too much sense to me. If the spell is inside the glyph then what are you learning besides how to point a glyph at someone and cast a spell? Your not really "learning" red way, for example, by buying a glyph and using the flame burst spell inside it.

An alternate idea(I was still thinking about this so thats why I proposed whats in my 1st post) would be instead to, as I mentioned eariler, make the glyphs strong spells. Then allow characters to use spells that the caster wields through the body instead of through a medium(like glyphs). You could start off with one spell and then learn more spells as you progress levels (maybe like every 10). This makes more sense to me because you are actually "learning" how to use a specific way of magic. If the glyph already has the spell inside it why do you get "better" at a magic way when all your doing is using the spell already there. My point is that when you use a glyph it doesn't seem as if your really learning a way you are just forcing energy into it(mana lost) inorder for the glyph to cast a spell.

Maybe I'm wrong about what a glyph is and how its used. However it seems to be like by using a glyph you really shouldn't be gaining any ability in a certain way of magic.   
Saggi Lezeheso, The Whisper's Jest
Demoik and Rioqura, The Immortal Harrow
Vertum, Will of Dakkru

Duraza Darkom, Slayer of Kittens

Quitarias

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 193
  • Sugested solution:Quarantine and/or death sentence
    • View Profile
    • A MUD gladiator game.Press link and level to make me rich.
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2007, 10:23:06 am »
Sounds pretty logic.But im not o sure about magic for each race.
Krans should of course have some sort of ability to go over the top in all physical disciplines since thats basicaly going to be the only thing their usefull for.
Enkis wouldnt have magic as they were hunters who lived of their own bountyso some sort of racial ability would be nice.Maybe for a litle bit they highten they dodge chance and weapon skills by concentrating.
Diabolis might have magic since their realm would sugest it beeing extremely dangerous and not completely natural.I would say magic to counter the heat would be inate to them.And also a resistance to heat and fire spells should be like Kran armor for them.
Ynnwn should have a physical boost like Krans.
Lemurs would only have a knack for glyph magic since they are after all the first race of Yliakum.
Dwarves wouldnt need any magic and i cant think ofwhat they would need besides a resistance to beer.
Dermorians might have magic to help comunicate.For some reason i always think of them as the elves who could talk to animals.
Noltirs probably wouldnt have needed magic in their world so throw them of the list.
Ylians might have had magic in their world but i would venture a guess it would be very similiar or identical to Xacha magic so we can make a single spell set for them.
Klyros might have needed spells to strenghten their bodies from time to time.Or spells to make things lighter.

Well these are my few thoughts on the matter.
Singned
  -One serious case of nuty.

fabpupuce

  • Traveller
  • *
  • Posts: 16
  • Character : Gromili, rune engraver
    • View Profile
    • My home page
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2007, 10:51:24 am »
Dwarfs don't need beer resistance, they naturally have it. >:(

But, there is a special magic way fir the dwarfs : RUNES.
Dwarfs do not manipulate spells and such instable devices, but they can draw magical runes on crafted items to make powerful weapons, armours, etc.
I think there are almost no magical weapons in PS at the moment, but I think it would a great way to introduce them.
Of course, there must be some limits, and drawing runes must be a long process (as crafting is already).
And at last,  it would make concrete the supremacy of dwarfs over the other races in crafting, in PS.  :P
Rune lord" border="0" align="topGromili, rune engraver
"When an elf, with his ancestral knowledge, meets a dwarf, with his ancestral axe, one is happy to be small an bearded !"

Xanacru

  • Guest
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2007, 11:31:22 am »
"Dwarfs + Runes" depends on how traditional they are in PlaneShift fantasy. There is nothing in the settings that mentions Runes. Sure, they have Runes in Tolkien and Warhammer fantasies but do they have them in PS?

This is an example of how Warhammer Online mentions Runes when it comes to Dwarfs (and btw, they do call them Dwarfs and not Dwarves in WH):

Quote from: Warhammer Online
Dwarfs don’t go in for magic. Like so many things embraced by humans and their allies it’s just much too new-fangled and unreliable, at least from the Dwarfen point of view. Now runes on the other hand, that’s a whole different story. Runes have an old power. Their carving is a ritual so refined that the results are as expected as rocks rolling down hill. The keepers of this art are the Runepriests, adepts and sages who spend their lives learning the language of runes. With their craft they can create effects of stunning power, accosting their foes with the power of the earth itself. They can also harden their allies against the most damaging of attacks, and heal their wounds.

I'd imagine if PlaneShift had Runes, they would have mentioned something. In PS it just seems that Dwarfs/Dwarves are not good at magic (or simply dislike it) but great at melee.

edit: fixed a typo
« Last Edit: June 06, 2007, 10:46:36 pm by Xanacru »

Duraza

  • Hydlaa Notable
  • *
  • Posts: 761
    • View Profile
    • Want to know the truth now?
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2007, 06:29:25 pm »
I would say dwarfs, like krans, aren't really those who would use magic a lot. I might be wrong but I doubt they should or would. Either way like I was saying maybe not exact race traits like I first said but there should be some kind of magic, or something along the lines of magic, avaliable for players besides glyphs. That will, in my opinion, make magic more intresting and attract more people to become spellcasters in PS. Right now, I think, you still basically have to become a warrior to be a spellcaster. You actually have to become a warrior no matter what you do because you need pp to kill monsters and spells aren't always most effective. Spells like arrow and energy arrow I heard do become pretty powerful but then lets say I want to become a Dark way mage (which I do  ;D ). The effectiveness of spells that do gradual damage is not high and the fact that I can not cast them from far away (weakness requires you to be in touching distance) does not help either. Maybe there is an alternative way to fix this probelm but I think adding another type of magic would not only fix it but make the game more intresting.
Saggi Lezeheso, The Whisper's Jest
Demoik and Rioqura, The Immortal Harrow
Vertum, Will of Dakkru

Duraza Darkom, Slayer of Kittens

Seytra

  • Forum Addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2049
  • No system can compensate lack of common sense.
    • View Profile
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2007, 09:58:15 pm »
I don't particularly like the idea of glyph-based magic either, but it's the way PS has decided to go. It does create a certain void in places, as you can't, for example, have any sort of innate spell or magic. Likewise, you cannot have magical anything, since that anything either needs to have an embedded glyph to power it (which isn't all that problematic since glyphs are readily available and can FAIK be copied as well, or at least transferred), or be powered by a spell being held active elsewhere, but that may be a particularity and not necessarily a drawback, as other magic systems are much more limited (D&D, for example).

Regardless of that, my view of how glyphs work is that they do not contain a spell, they contain a certain pattern in which the raw magic from the crystal is being channeled into the realm. When one uses a glyph, one uses it's pattern to channel magic into some effect, but the effect itself must still be determined by the caster, and the energy flowing from the glyph must be controlled and given additional shaping to actually yield the desired effect. Naturally, each glyph has a spell, or set of spells, that it lends itself to easily. With additional wisdom and experience, a caster can exert greater control over the energy output, fine-tune it, and at some point even tune it to yield different results (even though the general category remains the same, so one can't make a water glyph cast fire spells; at least it would require an exceptional degree of profession to work at all, and even more to become effective, certainly more than "just" mastering all magic ways, so it would possibly be something academic without any real-life use). At greater degrees of knowledge and experience, one can combine different glyphs (or possibly more than just one of each kind) to create further diverse spells, or to gain more raw power for the simpler spells (more than 100% power maybe, if that relates to the power handling capacity of a single glyph?). In order to synchronise these, it clearly takes more knowledge and experience, so indeed one is actually learning something when levelling through the magic ways.

Lastly, I do not think that the races would necessarily or even likely have had any sort of magic before arriving in Yliakum (that was ages ago, so it would hardly matter in Yliakum today). Since the crystal is the source of all magic, upon leaving it's vincinity (maybe not the stone labyrinths, but possibly the planetary surface), the glyphs would become powerless and maybe even vanish if they're powered by magic themselves. What does make sense is to give the, or at least some, races a certain "knack" towards some spells (or rather effects / areas of magic), which however is, at least in part, already in the race descriptions.

This could be used to make some such "last resort" spell (by way of an amulet containing a glyph, plus the very specialised training in the use of this one glyph to the greatest effect (including the ability to channel all remaining mana (plus maybe a bit more, as it's not "general purpose" mana) through it)), with the described aftereffects due to the mental stress. This wouldn't necessarily be race-bound (though the kind of spell likely would), and nowhere near everyone would possess it.

Additionally, even though this is quite a stretch, one could imagine transferring a glyph onto oneself, possibly even as a sort of birth rite, which would make for similar effects. Maybe, however, glyphs can only be transferred to lifeless objects, and I imagine that only very few (or just one) can be fit onto one single object.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2007, 10:03:37 pm by Seytra »

Raleigh

  • Guest
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2007, 10:22:07 pm »
     If you don't like much the way magic works, there is still the unraveling power of the sentient mind on its psionic energies, capable of altering the shape of the environment according to one's will, the misterious psychic secrets of the school of Lah'ar sometimes even overlap the capabilities of the magically enhanced glyphs. Now would it be possible to combine the psionic influences of the mind to shape the raw magic or to interact with the power of the glyphs?
    There are many possibilities beyond the mere possibility of races having their own exclusive magic powers, something that sounds somewhat clichĂ© to me and that I think, from what I know about the Settings, that would not match up well with the nature of Planeshift.

Xanacru

  • Guest
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2007, 11:23:29 pm »
In the older versions of PS, the schools of Argan, Lah'ar and Esteria were listed in their own group titled "Martial Arts". Unless it has been changed, that's what they are probably still intended for.

Raleigh

  • Guest
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2007, 11:28:04 pm »
In the older versions of PS, the schools of Argan, Lah'ar and Esteria were listed in their own group titled "Martial Arts". Unless it has been changed, that's what they are probably still intended for.

I really doubt that something described as involving powers like "mind control, ESP, telekinesis and related" has something to do with "Martial Arts" on the traditional sense of the word.

Xanacru

  • Guest
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2007, 11:34:11 pm »

Raleigh

  • Guest
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #12 on: June 07, 2007, 12:22:44 am »
     Remember that Planeshift is an open Beta/Alpha/Pre-alpha so everything is subjected to changes, the descriptions of the skills Lah'ar, Argan and Esteria on this version clearly demonstrate they aren't schools of martial arts, but of psionics. Many things were changed, many concepts dismissed(For example I heard that initially there were female Krans, not sure if it's true though). This "Martial Arts" screen is obsolete now @Xanacru.

Xanacru

  • Guest
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2007, 01:35:17 am »
Hence, why I clearly stated - "unless it has been changed". Pay attention @ Raleigh. ;)

bilbous

  • Guest
Re: Race Traits
« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2007, 02:36:28 am »
Actually I do not see much conflict between martial arts and those kind of effects. If you look at some of the films in the genre from the orient, they are filled with magical effects that are the result of mental discipline. They fly, they power-blow at a distance, they know where the enemy is without seeing and other things not seen in your typical western made martial arts film. The server is based in Singapore so a nod in that direction is not too far fetched.