Just a few observations

[Vistralan]

let me start by saying I've tried to play about 4 or 5 times (downloading and installing) over the last year or so, but ended up giving up due to no clue as to how to play. Now I got bored last night and thought what the heck I'll read the manual and figure out how it works right...well kinda. here is the experience I had last night.

After figuring out the whole creation process and uploading my char I just wanted to get into a fight with some small critter, I hit M on the keyboard to bring up a map, but instead got kicked into a different view mode. I then looked up the controls and found out there is no map at all so I ran around for an hour ...Lost....and didn't find one critter, so I did a search for some maps online and found out in the process that map are considered a "cheat/spoiler"...that kinda seemed odd to me. but after checking the map asking people around the blacksmithing trees I found the place. Cool now on to the fun stuff lets kill something and save up for a weapon...only my char has like 0 ability in unarmed so this rat kicks the snot out of me in all the different stances I tried.

So now I'm in the death plane a little frustrated but liking the atmosphere of this place, so I desided to explore it a bit and then showed up at the start again due to falling into blackness after a very short run up a flight of stairs. That continued in 1 fashion or another for about 30 min till I asked to be led to the exit (by the first person I saw down here) who was kind enough to ablidge me. (I really wish I remembered your name...thanks to all those that help ppl out of that place)

after 5 min of searching I find the hole into the sewer again and tried using defensive stance...it worked the rat died before me. cool time to loot. Cool I got an eyeball and a tail I'll have a dagger in no time...but my life is at 25%...and I can't figure out how to heal myself so I sit down IG and IRL go make myself a sandwich come back and now I'm at 50%hp hmm ok I'll ask this rock guy....no responce, maybe the elf chick nope, the guy in the helm? Yes, but he doesn't tell me, he does however sit there for about a min and cast this thing that seems to be healing me. Then he asks me if I have trias, I reply no so he helps me kill a few rats by effectivly becoming a heal bot for me...nice but I kinda want to have a healing kit or some such then he asks me if I have animal parts...OMG yes I do...like 10 of them, he takes me to Arena to show me where to sell them...(LONG trek to unload some junk) then takes me into the halls of the arena to find me a weapon...20 min later I'm a sword swinging fool all thanks to the Nice guy in the horned helm. so back to the rats kill some more and I get a progress point cool a level I think, nope a point to place in a skill so I head up and over to the sword trainer I found earlier, I buy a point worth figuring that is enough to go from 0>1....nope so back down to the rats. I look at my skills w/ a glance and notice I have 4 in daggers....so I go and sell the equipment the nice helmed guy gave me and grab 2 daggers...they worked great when I got back down there.

after about 20 min I look at my stats page and find out I'm a leatherworking armor repairing herb gatherer...ok off to find a needle and thread to make me a suit of rat hide...after an hour found out that rat hide is worthless so I should sell it...made 80 tria cool....never did find out where or how to make a suit of armor...but whatever found the dagger trainer so that was a plus and I finally found a quest....some guy wants his Abacus back from some dwarf....cool, lets look for him, hours later asking a few ppl no luck...I gave up and deside to buy some armor...and found out that I was a woefull 1600 tria short of the full set and 200 short of buying the gloves...hmm this could take a while...4 1/2 hrs in fact. after I got my armor I called it a night.

after 8 hours I had (with alot of help) 2 daggers and a full suit of armor, had spent about 2K tria on skills was broke and found out the minimum basics that I would have known in 10min if I had an in game map, the rudamentery basics of "leveling" were undestood, still had no way to heal(still don't know where to begin on that one).

so I know it's a long time in coming but the summery:

No maps...not even a sign post and no NPCs answering questions like "where is a leatherworker/tanner/healer/my quest NPC"
No Compass....
no basic starting equipment... even a farmboy has a butter knife (when I was a farmboy I had a wide assortment of very painful tools at my disposal aka pitchfork, scythe ect)
because of the "no spoiler" rule the forums might as well be "read the manual again"...as for basic "where can I find X"...useless do to "RP" rules(in D&D your GM will tell you where the X shop is)
besides a 1 shot potion, no way to heal (those things are expensive)(again as a farmboy I had a first aid kit, simple but effective...they have had bandages from the ancient egyptian times so it won't break your RP environment)
I read the manual and in theory know it might be possible to craft something though I have no Idea about the how/where/what I need of it

Another thing that kinda puzzled me...the RP thing that the Developers want so badly seems to be broken by their own design, sewers w/ pipes and all didn't come into effect untill late 1800's, internal plumbing was the same. sure the romans used hot springs and pipes and an aquiduct system not to mention concrete but I swear I ran through the same sewers in Anarchy Online and Neocron...just an observation

the Crashes, cumbersome controls, lack of sound, lack of animation, buggy targeting, AI issues, lack of monsters, graphical glitches, getting stuck, I can forgive after all it is free and in alpha (though I haven't seen a difference in the game from a year ago...then again I didn't play for too long any of the other times)

anyways once you get past all it's flaws it seems like it has great potential...I just hope it gets the attn to the playability that it has gotten to the story line so far

[Donari Tyndale]

No maps? That would be new to me. Have you ever checked with Jayose in the library? You can buy a map of Hydlaa there. Besides, there is another map of Hydlaa on the wall of the library. Starting equipment? I think you mix this game up with some others. Planeshift is not Runescape/Eternal Lands etc...And in fact, there is another way to heal. Have you ever tried asking around (Someone else besides NPCs)?. Again, concerning crafting, did you actually ask around? You can craft weapons and shields so far.
Now something concerning the lack of orientation problem. Currently, the world of Planeshift isn't that huge. I am sure you'll learn it by heart soon. True, Planeshift still lacks some features, but you will find no other game with such a 1337-free community. If you seek a true RPing game, PS is the right game. However, if you want to battle creatures/PCs, craft some cool stuff and be the best, there are other games....

P.S. You can actually craft almost everything. You just need to RP it.

P.P.S. This isn't our world, so pipes can be part of the environment.

[Duraza]

That didn't seem too bad

Firstly there is no map for the reason that their is (or will be) a map creating ssytem. Players will be able to make their own maps and such ( I think we can already I just don't know how)

Your skills all depend on what you chose for your life during character creation. Also I belive before you upload your character your skills are displayed (I may be wrong and it might have changed after the update). Also depending on the rat you attacked you may have died quicker (some monsters of the same kind will be stronger than others).

Death Realm is supposed to be eternal punishment so if your new its not easy. Sadly the "eternal" part of the punishment doesn't exist yet. Once you learn your way out its more like skipping through a field of flowers then running with fear through a dark realm of evil. Lucky for you someone found you and helped you (which most people will do anyways as long as you approach them and ask rply).

Training is tough. Its realistic that way. You can't kill one rat and expect to suddenly become a swords master. Sometimes people are afk so they don't respond. Sometimes people are just rude. And other times if you don't talk ICly to someone they ignore you. All depends on how you approached each person for their response. As for healing its magic. You could by potions but what the guy with the helm was doing was using a spell he found ingame. Your pretty lucky you found the helm guy in the first place   .

Making armor and a lot of other stats aren't ingame yet so don't get disappointed if there are skills you have but can't use. Remember this game isn't complete yet. Quests can be hard so just try your best and even ICly ask other characters for help. Things in this game can also be very expensive for a new player. Don't worry though, things only get more expensive as you start training in higher levels. Be thankful, right now you actually have it easyier.  

Look what you completed in 8 hours of game play. You should pat yourself on the back. It can take people weeks before they even find their way to the sewers to die in the first place. I had to delete my first character because of my extreme hate of the death realm when I was new, only to learn much later that its not the least bit complicated.

As for the rest, you'll just have to get used to bugs, crashes, and all the rest. Like you said this game is Alpha so there is a lot of things that need to be done. You should be thankful its free   .

In the end I only have one question. Though you went through so much hardship will you play it again? Fact is even with all the hardship of being new its a lot of fun regardless. Keep playing, things can only get better now.

[Lanarel]

I will try to summarize your story:
"I could not find a map, finally asked someone, who told me where to get one. Great, I got a map!"
"Died and got lost in the dead realm. Finally asked someone, who took the time to show me the way out. Thanks!"
"Got hurt by a rat, and did not know how to heal myself quicker than sitting their waiting. Asked some other new players (they seem to frequent rat infested places) until finally someone not only healed me, but stayed to help me kill rats for a while and then went out of his way to show me where to sell the loot, and get some decent weapons. Thanks!"

I see a pattern here.

"After playing a day, I still am not able to buy the cool stuff others bought after playing for much longer"
"I am new, but want to skip the stuff all others are doing before they start crafting. I want to know how to make a fortune crafting, and besides, why do I not start with a fortune so I can buy all crafting skills at once?"

And finally:
"Role playing would be much better without all the pipes in the sewers."

Well, I cannot help you with the last one, but maybe the answer to the middle part follows from the pattern in the first. The first standard answer given when you have a question is not 'read the manual', or 'check the forums' but 'ask other characters (both players and NPCs) in game, in a nice and friendly way'. You already learned that that works, it may also allow you to see past the pipes and enjoy role playing more, especially if you also talk to other characters when you do not need their help.

I know starting this game as a new player can be a bit difficult, but you already seem to have come past all the obstacles most people get stuck at at first (where are rats, how to get out of this terrible dark place). You even seem to like the death realm . If after that you still think you should have a map and an easy way to make money (and it will get easier quickly anyway), and to be able to enjoy a pipeless scenery, preferably by not talking to others, then maybe this game just is not for you. Otherwise, go to the tavern and have a beer. It may even heal your wounds

p.s. Some replies were posted while I was typing. Haven't read those yet. Also, I used to used many more smileys in my posts, but I only see three here. Please read this as if there are many more

[Draklar]

You bring up really decent points, Vistralan.
The thing is the dev team is well aware of these drawbacks and much of that stuff should be fixed sooner or later ;)

And you'll surely find more modernish stuff in Planeshift. The more that glyps can be used to power up some things. In the end it gives somewhat bizarre contrast between backwardness and the complex machinery. It may work well for the atmosphere.

[Vistralan]

a few points of interest

as for will I play again ya, I'm going to give it a week or so to test the waters =)
and like the name implies it was just a few observations I really wasn't trying to flame
and I didn't know the library sold maps till reading the posts...so thanks =)
I love RP and always try to IC my questions
as for starter equipment I just figured that I would have taken more than my undies from wherever I came from(I started as a winged reptile in a loin cloth)
as for the pipe thing, I got over it before I posted it...sorry it was late hehe

anyways the biggest upside to this game is the player base...haven't met a bad one yet
all in all fun game even w/ it's flaws once you get past the info void of the startup


p.s. the statement "It can take people weeks before they even find their way to the sewers to die in the first place."...isn't that a little extreme?
p.p.s. I didn't mean to come off greedy or anything, sorry if I did, I was trying to "try out" the craft skill ect, not make a gold plated ruby encrusted vorpal sword of gods (hmm note to self find rat hide patterns and make a killing from selling them to sewer squatters..JK) =)

[Karyuu]

We've been discussing giving players starter items for a long time now, so we definitely agree that new characters should start out with a little basic something. What we need in place is a system that will prevent abusing this - for example making the starter items untradeable and unsellable, which in turn means there needs to be a new way to get rid of them once you've moved on, so it takes a bit of work to really make this addition beneficial. I've no doubts that in the near future, you won't start out with an empty inventory.

[hulla]

Hi i dont take the time to read everything in this page but .... when you comme for the first time in 'ps" you HAVE an "Item" whit you
ok perhaps at zero but you have !you can "kill rats" and loot whit ! the "melee" skill !
and for manny people comming in gamme what something like all the other "videogamme" you can find !sommething like 10 hours maxi for playing whit !but this is not this kind of thing you need time (perhpas to mutch time)before biginning to be "strong" and for learning the "thing you need to know" and manny manny time you can read "making progression point and buy new skill wath NOT the more fun thing to do "

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

vistralan, honestly these comments are invaluable, and the fact that you spoke your piece without load omfg this game sux wtf i hate this etc. makes it the case that it comes across as a valid complaint. Please continue to document your newbie experience here in the interest of devs being able to view the problems. Hats off to you for keeping things calm and stating your case without vitriol so common to this subsection of the forum. Honestly we mean to help.

[Duraza]

p.s. the statement "It can take people weeks before they even find their way to the sewers to die in the first place."...isn't that a little extreme?

Nope. Some people literally wander around the game for a while before they find out the right area for them to fight. Most of the time its because you didn't bother to ask someone nicely 

We've been discussing giving players starter items for a long time now, so we definitely agree that new characters should start out with a little basic something. What we need in place is a system that will prevent abusing this - for example making the starter items untradeable and unsellable, which in turn means there needs to be a new way to get rid of them once you've moved on, so it takes a bit of work to really make this addition beneficial. I've no doubts that in the near future, you won't start out with an empty inventory.

Another MMORPG that I've played (no rp sadly..) called Silkroad thought of a way to do that which I think is useful. You start off with the weapon type of your choice in character creation however this weapon is the weakest of its type. You can't find the weapon ingame because all other weapons are better than it. Lastly the weapon (if you try to sell it) is worthless so really after using it in your newbie stages it useless. It might help to be able to have a weapon like that for each weapon skill avalible at character creation.

[Vistralan]

day 2 I played around asking people (IC) about healing after about an hour I got a response and desided to try to get the healing spell...about an hour later I had it (had to get the question right to the NPC I guess) ended up doing 2 quests for him (a thought might be to italic or bold trigger words to help people like me...just a thought).

After getting the spell I thought why not get some chainmail armor...beef up the defence a bit, so I ran to the arena...but she only sold shields, oh well. while running out I saw someone in non-leather asking as politly as I could I asked him where I could get some and he told me to head out to a different city (he gave me directions, even the name of his favorite dealer). I head out to this new town, and 15 min later realize that I am woefully short on funds. not being daunted (heck it's only 5-6K more than I have) I type /die to save me a return trip (I know not RP...I'm trying but that run/sit/run was a little tedious).

I notice that people are selling gold ore for quite a bit. I bought mining skill w/ my remaining PP and a pickaxe w/ almost the rest of my cash. One thing I found in life is that Miners are very secretive of they're mining locations ( I know I could have asked but this one I felt like RPing IG), so I deftly stalked a miner (easy to ID carrying his pick through town) and after running all over town following him, he finally led me to the spot (he actually asked me why I was following him, after I told him he laughed and led me there). mining is something I have done in every game I've played it seems...after an hour and a half I had a full pack and I was ready to train to lvl 2 in mining, so I headed back to town got 5Kish off that load not too shabby. Trained up to L2 mining and headed out to get the remaining 3K I needed for a full set of chainmail. 1 1/4hr later I was skilled up, met a new buddy and had a pack full of gold. after selling I ran back to the other town strait away bought my full set of chainmail and found out I wasted about 2K because I had to sell it back, I'm too weak...but I have 2 points in Med Armor...ok this really ticked me off I just spent over 3.5hrs getting up the cash running around to find out I'm too weak...and it's not like I can just pack it in the bank or stuff it in my locker. I understand the RP thing "stat req" posted on the item...but a "you must be able to lift X amount to wear this" or "this looks too heavy to use right now" would have been nice (by lifting X amount I mean how much in inventory you can carry as that would not give you the str# needed but a more realistic figure).

ok well I deside to train up some in daggers 30 min later I run to wher I trained them on day 2 and found...she switched skills to train....great....

Logged off

to sum up:

Achived 1 thing that bugged me on day 1 ... Healing - about 2 hrs
Started making good cash flow - 3 hrs
Was annoyed at not being able to wear something my char is trained to wear - 1hr
Was further annoyed by my trainers choice in "switching professions" 45min

As you can see the day was a mixed bag good in the begining worse later on

Quick question would it be possible to add a trainers list w/ city and name and list there skills they train....I'd pay good Tria for that, possibly sold at the Library?

[bilbous]

As far as no bank is concerned a lot of people use a spare character to hold things for their main. It is one of those things that is officially discouraged but tolerated as long as you don't leave it standing beside you while you fight/mine etc. As for that healing spell I've had my character for a couple years and still have not found it so you are ahead of the game there. I'm not looking too hard and do not ask very often.

Perhaps there could be some lighter medium armor made available such as zinc chainmail, less durable and whatnot.

[acraig]

This thread raises a somewhat important point.  There are really 2 major issues in development that are going on. 

The first is actually making the game 'work'.   This is stuff like make sure that the client or server doesn't crash, make sure that when items are equipped they look ok, make sure spells do what they are supposed to.  This is often a very complex and time consuming effort since there are a lot of different things going on and keeping track of them is not always easy.   A lot of this is not really noticable on the player side.

The second is to make the game 'playable'.  This is things like adding in the quests, updating the crafting system, making more spells, improving the graphics etc.   These are things that are very noticable by the player. 

We are spending a lot more time in the first area because even though players might not see 1% of the work there it has the biggest impact on their game.  If the server crashes, nobody can play.  But all they see is if the server is up or not.  They don't see the gigabytes of core files that are being generated and examined.     However, when the server is up they do see new areas and items and that is what is discussed the most. 

Now that the team has grown a bit more we are trying to focus a bit more on how players actually play the game.  We still need to focus a lot of attention on the 'engine' but I feel that we can spend a bit more time on improving the player interaction and make it a better game over all.   

[Vistralan]

Day 3

started off good (found where I can inc my str and the aprox amount I will need to wear the med armor)(and yes I do get obsessed over silly little things like that easily), I went to the trainer and spent all the progression points I had got 3.5 full lvls of str...cool now I can carry more.

Desided to hit the sewer again to get some more $ and PP...hmm monsters are Invulnerable to attack, ok I'll check back later

Went mining for an hour came to town to sell. Then I checked the sewer...still broken

2.5hrs of mining (a nice dwarf bought my gold for more than Harquin pays) cool got more than enough cash for my current needs. I bought some glyphs...no new spells but whatever it was a why not purchace anyways

ran to town to check the sewers...still broken....arrg

Logged off

now the a few good things I can say is I didn't crash all night, and I felt like I made progression (not the kind I wanted but hey it's something)

the negatives ,couldn't do what I wanted do to a bug, and I found out I really don't know what stats do what, also fairly frustrated that I'm still hunting in the sewers (2 days of fighting off and on in the sewers with minimal progression and 1 day it was not available to do), found out if I want a helm I need to get one from a GM a fellow player told me (will check up on this more tomorrow) discuraged due to the fact I haven't seen one and I'm not going to brown nose to get one. the chat system is getting annoying...editable channels would be nice

the negs were far outweighed by the possitives as I still felt like I had fun when I logged off, but the negs were just gripes that kinda brought the meter down abit

Anyways unless I get a request to do it again I think this might be one of the last regular "diary of a new guy" type postings...might put something up in suggestions or something

Hope I haven't ticked anyone off

Vistralan

PS My ingame is also Vistralan, if you have tips/suggestions or need help I can provide let me know =)

[Karyuu]

GMs give out items only during roleplay events. Several helmets, however, you can get by doing NPC quests.