Author Topic: magic is weak  (Read 6072 times)

SynergfyFlo

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magic is weak
« on: December 26, 2007, 09:56:29 am »
hey folks,

i really like the idea of researching different glyph combinations to discover new spells.

however, the spells i have come across so far are hardly worth the effort of researching.
summon missile generates little more than an annoying pinprick, and freeze is hardly noticeable.

anyone with a breadknife is more dangerous than a mage who has quested far and wide to develop his powers.
without a trusty-rusty sword to fall back on, very few mages in this world would have even half a chance of living long enough to become powerful.

magic should be frighteningly powerful and intimidating, especially if it is mysterious and difficult to learn.

ok, just my opinion again - i really like the game and can't wait to see it grow and develop!

thanks, devs,

Flo
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Zan

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #1 on: December 26, 2007, 10:29:59 am »
It is known and being worked on soon (tm) .. believe it or not but magic used to be worse :P

I wouldn't expect it to be what you want it to be though, if magic is frighteningly powerful it will not be mysterious anymore. It will be the thing everyone learns just so they can kick ass. Magic needs to be on equal foot to other combat mechanisms and preferably a bit more versatile. This makes up for the time and effort spent acquiring glyphs and the ability to wield them.
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Sen

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2007, 12:30:56 pm »
First, I second that magic has (at least at lower levels, I don't know about higher) a weak effect.

I personally like the thought of strong magic. I can imagine that a powerful mage can cast a spell that has great[tm] effect and is then able to cast a few weaker (still stronger than weapon hits?) spells. He then has of course to rest and is pretty much defenseless for a long time, so he _has_ to defeat his enemies with these few spells.
This is not what I want to see implemented, it's rather a thought about how magic can work.

The other, and propably some day implemented, way is, that magic spells have a somewhat similar effect like weapons at an equal level of training.
Anyways, Im glad to hear that corrections are being worked on  :thumbup:

Sen
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Paranoia

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2007, 12:38:54 pm »
"It is known and being worked on soon"
well, im the next one waiting for it.

as well as for above i wait for penalty taking place when you wear heavy type of armor (or any armor at all?) and cast spells.

ps. sorry for my english.

SynergfyFlo

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #4 on: December 26, 2007, 03:12:58 pm »
yeah, but the fact that things are being worked on does suggest that the discussions we are having may unfold some influence on the shape the game takes.

frighteningly powerful is still my preference. with the spell power bar, one could introduce variable risks, depending on your skill, your ambition, and your present situation/condition. such risks could take similar form to the process of glyph research - damage due to failed attempts.

other ways to balance overly-powerful spells might include spell mishaps, e.g. an entirely different spell effect, or a spell effect unfolds on a different target ("sorry mate, didn't mean to turn you into a turkey..."), or equipment is damaged due to an uncontrolled discharge of magical energies...the devs' imagination and ingenuity is the limit. ;)

also, the process of spell learning could be something run via other player characters. this could encourage the development of realistic rp-like mage guilds and hierarchies of teachers, practitioners, students, novices, etc who learn from each other - up to the point of secret traditions of guild-specific spells.

i think the entire magic field provides huge opportunities to introduce player-driven mystique and dynamic politics into this aspect of the game without devoting too much focus to how spells compare with weapons as a combat strategy. magic runs much deeper than this.
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Tontow

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2007, 09:57:40 pm »
 :whistling: Crafted Glyphs anyone?  Just a thought.
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Caarrie

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #6 on: December 26, 2007, 10:04:21 pm »

TDB

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2007, 01:21:52 am »
:whistling: Crafted Glyphs anyone?  Just a thought.

Um, the glyphs are crafted by Talad, and nobody can hope to even come close to the power and skills needed. It also looks like there are more powerful glyphs crafted by Vodùl, but even the relatively weaker gods Talad and Laanx can barely use those.

SynergfyFlo

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2007, 07:48:25 am »
granted that the glyphs are mysterious items whose crafting lies beyond the ken of ordinary mortals...
however, they do provide yet another avenue by which pc's can become involved in the economy and participate in roleplaying scenarios relating to magic.

whence do they come? who finds them? who transports them? who supplies traders like levrus with his stock?

perhaps there is a glyph that enables one to locate other glyphs? perhaps there is a secret order of mages whose calling it is to brave the wilds and find the glyphs? perhaps the glyphs appear in this world through portals that also allow other, more sinister forces to enter...? 
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John80sk

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #9 on: December 27, 2007, 07:57:17 am »
The skills to find glyphs somehow might be nice at least...

But anyways, magic isn't really weak, it just lacks the ability to progress smoothly that combat has.  It's getting closer with spell power and such, just not quite there yet.  The low level spells are, for the most part, fairly useless... and those that aren't useless lack the ability to generate tria and progression points at a reasonable rate.  However, this is just a lack of content, something you can expect in a beta.
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Kayden

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2007, 08:51:41 am »
My main character has 160 Charisma, 20 Crystal Way, and I can use up my entire mana on Energy Arrows—a second realm spell—and not even kill a single rat.  Meanwhile my other character with mediocre sword skill and two random short swords can kill one in two blows.  To me, there's no question—magic is ridiculously underpowered.

If I recall, it was actually better for a time, though still not great...I think the armor computations on monsters may have been corrected, and magic likely wasn't bumped accordingly.
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Zan

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2007, 11:08:18 am »
Yeah, you're right Nilaya .. just before the monsters became stronger magic was doable. Then they made the monsters stronger but didn't boost up magic as well.

As for the glyph crafting thing ... definitely a no-no but what you can be, and one of my characters is, is a Glyph hunter. They don't make the glyphs, they just search for them. According to the settings glyphs can appear in many unexpected places including on plants, rocks and even the skin of creatures. A Glyph hunter is simply a person who makes it their job to search out glyphs and sell them.
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Xillix Queen of Fools

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2007, 04:23:02 pm »
Not a bad Idea zan. . .

Tontow

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2007, 07:03:41 pm »
Yeah, you're right Nilaya .. just before the monsters became stronger magic was doable. Then they made the monsters stronger but didn't boost up magic as well.

As for the glyph crafting thing ... definitely a no-no but what you can be, and one of my characters is, is a Glyph hunter. They don't make the glyphs, they just search for them. According to the settings glyphs can appear in many unexpected places including on plants, rocks and even the skin of creatures. A Glyph hunter is simply a person who makes it their job to search out glyphs and sell them.

Not exactly.  If you read it says that mages transfer the Glyph's energy to small ez to carry stones; It is these stones that could be crafted.
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Xillix Queen of Fools

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Re: magic is weak
« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2007, 01:28:10 am »
* Xillix Queen of Fools looks at the people crafting stones and picks up a rock and casts his glyph onto it.