OOC discussion about: [RP] Behind Sealed Doors...

[Suno_Regin]

[Can't really say these 'uber characters' are actually playing the game, either. We expect, eventually, that Xathen and my alt will die some time down the road. It's an extended player RP event, and we're using them for the event; the basis.]

[Dajoji]

[like I said, you are limited by the lack of GM commands and your characters can be only as powerful as other players find agreeable. And you can always contact someone in settings to make sure you're not stepping out of boundaries with your plot as well. That should put an end to that unnecessary debate.]

[Socius Rockus]

[ At least we know whose fault it is when we see newbies claim to have 'powerz', to claim they are DEMONS FROMZ HELL!! or VAMPIRE HUNTER LORDS!!!! It's all in giving a good example  . Even without 'unrealistic' powers a nice plot can be made, though it requires more creativity.
I really like the story btw But that's not the point    ]

[Raa]

[Silly willies. 

Can someone pliz delete all these OOC-ish posts sometime in the future? It really clutters up the thread.]

[Dajoji]

[Indeed, but they make good points. Perhaps a mod can move them to an OOC thread or something.]

[Kieve]

[*laughs hysterically* Wraiths as comic relief? Now that one I wouldn't have seen coming...

Sorry if you didn't mean it to be so funny Suno - the little wraith's overeagerness is quite comical.]

[Prolix]

[There's a difference between bad roleplay and something that goes against settings. Even if wraiths aren't supposed to exist, Kieve's done an excellent job in setting the picture, and plays his characters how they would act as if he was really them. Besides, GMs have certainly gone against settings in the past, and godmod. For example, the recent event with a GM turning everyone into clackers with some sort of magic, and people having to find the wand and change them back (I'm just using that as an example from word of mouth - I wasn't actually there). If that had been a player event, people would be flaming the player up and down about something like that being against settings, and being too powerful - like you're doing to the wraith setting. If Kieve was a GM, you certainly wouldn't have -anything- to complain about.]

I disagree with the first statement because the settings are the rules for the roles that you may play, therefor stepping outside the settings is bad roleplay. For example, if you were to be given this setup

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you have brought only one knife to a confrontation with a rival gang at the improv olympics (role play competition) and you 'pull out a gun and start shooting your rivals' you are going to lose the match because you went against the setup. Likewise if you are stipulated to  be a blind man and you miraculously regain your sight the same thing is likely to happen.

I do wish you would stop accusing me of flaming as my posts have been quite polite and not at all heated.

One last thing, if you bothered to filter your ideas through the GM team you might find one who would go along with it and be able to convince the rest of the team to allow it. If that cannot be done then perhaps your ideas need to be rethought to fit in and you may even get positive feedback as to what changes would allow it.

[Under the moon]

Actually, these ideas would go through Settings, not the GMs. The GMs use Settings material to create their events.

GMs and Settings devs only step in if the RP deviates fairly far from the official settings, and people complain. Only one of two is happening here.

[Kieve]

Prolix - I do appreciate your criticisms, as they are well thought-out and certainly polite enough.
(I do not see any 'flames' here myself)

As for your example, my response would be to take out a gang-member and steal his gun, since nowhere is it specified that he does not have one. That is what I am doing - expanding on lore with my own ideas, using what information is available to me. And while I am not about to toot my own horn, I will say that with the exception of the Etherwights' existence itself, I have stayed well within Settings bounds. Its creation, habits, and so-forth are all very explicable in-game according to what knowledge we've been given thus far - which is a fair sight more than most of the so-called 'outlandish' chars can claim (at least that I've seen). Regarding your last comment, I did not run this by a GM because I saw no particular need to - doing so makes it a GM event in my eyes, not mine. So to sum up, just because the wraith itself is pushing Settings (and I never claimed it didn't - quite the contrary), the use and application of such is certainly within bounds.

On the note of Xathen himself and claims of 'uberness' - please read through the RP threads a bit. He has unique abilities, true, but he is FAR from uber, and I have never played him as such (possibly why there hasn't been a larger faction of people screaming for my hide).

With regard to Etherwight purpose and origin, they drain life energy (ie, the soul), and so victims normally die a true death, with only ash remaining. This is why they are regarded as unholy by Dakkru followers and the Goddess herself - their method of feeding denies the Dark Crystal its fuel. And yet, despite this, I have not yet used him to drain ANY player to the point of permanent death, and have only seriously considered it once. In fact, if you wish to tear my wraith to pieces, I suppose it's best if you are given the full readout on him. Been meaning to make it public knowledge through RP, but since this discussion has grown a bit more than I expected it to...

[Kieve]

Now bear in mind, this was written mainly with an eye towards in-game RP combat. Having said that, you may ask almost anyone I've used Xathen against - while challenging, he has his own flaws and faults, which were recently revealed to an exacting degree in the Wraithbane RP, and certainly far from 'uber'.


Xathen Ut'Phare - Technical Readout

Background: An entity composed of living shadows. It survives by draining energies both magical and physical to sustain its own. Born of wild magic in the Stone Labyrinths, it was further shaped and guided by the will of Black Flame and its followers, up to and including its present form.

At the current time, it has full control over all 'natural' shadows within its sight and can shape them into physical instruments (spikes, sludge, etc) at will. Alternately, it can use these to drain a target of life force and magic without physical contact, but the victim must be at least partially surrounded by shadowmass.

Abilities:
Shadowmass

• Physical strikes - the wraith may form any natural shadow into a physical weapon, which remains rooted to its point of origin. These strikes are sudden and come without warning, but obey most physical laws. They can be blocked or deflected by most any magical or physical means and dissipate after the turn in which they are used.
• Shadowsmoke - a method of draining a victim remotely, the wraith's black fog rises from a shadow. It can begin draining instantly, but the effect is very weak, and only in more viscous stages does the siphoning have any real effect. Typically, it takes multiple turns to engulf and thicken shadowsmoke enough for proper draining.
• Sludge and Solid mass - 'thickened' shadowsmoke may take one of two additional forms after its emergence. The first and initial stage is a viscous sludge, the consistancy of which is somewhere between mud and poured concrete. It clings to any surface and drains energies at a more efficient rate. The second stage, should the wraith will it, is to further solidify it into rock-hard mass. This is the most effective form of energy-drain, and once solidified it may then act as a 'natural' shadow for the launching of physical attacks. It must first phase through the viscious form however, and is typically used to lock a victim in place.

Wraith

• Energy Drain - the wraith's primary weapon is the natural ability to siphon and consume nearly any variety of magical or physical energy. Offensive magics are automatically absorbed, if they are of a compatible type (see Weaknesses), while physical energies and especially life forces must be deliberately drained. The latter is excruciatingly painful for the victim.
• Claws - in its natural form, the wraith's hands end in three-fingered claws (two upper, and an opposed thumb). These are razor-sharp at the tip and are capable of piercing solid plate metal.
• Strength - the wraith's physical strength is directly based upon the energy it consumes. Since exiting the labyrinth, the Azure Sun has filled it with a surplus of energy, granting the wraith an immense strength. Additionally, prey has been more plentiful, and the Crystal's light adds a surplus of energy to the wraith's victims.
• Sorrow and Scorn - the twin greatswords Xathen carries at his back. These bear runic markings of the Black Flame and are the only weapons in Xathen's arsenal capable of deflecting damage from his primary weaknesses. In his hands, they weigh almost nothing, as they are an extension of himself - should he drop them, their actual weight is roughly half a ton each.
• Shadowmerge - a wraith may spread its life essence into natural shadow, effectively becoming part of the darkness. It then becomes impossible to pinpoint the wraith's location, as it is literally 'everywhere' at once. However, the wraith has very limited control over any other shadow aspect, and must reassume a physical form to interact with the world.

Weaknesses
Blue Way & Magic

• Blue Way Glyphs - due to the purifying properties of Blue Way magic, any spells generated from a glyph classified under the Blue Way will do significant damage to the wraith, who is incapable of absorbing such magic.
• Mental Attacks - mind-based magics affect the wraith (who is a sentient creature). Illusions are only partially effective, as no caster can replicate the 'energy sense' a wraith uses for hunting, and a wraith will readily separate visual illusions from the real for this reason. Mental or psyonic assaults will harm the wraith, and in extreme cases can completely disperse its physical form, causing it to revert to a shadowmerged state.
• Dark Way - though a wraith can absorb Dark Way magics, the 'foul taste' of such energies cause discomfort, and in extreme cases nausea, in the absorbing wraith. Excessive use may cause a temporary 'taint' in the being, and even permanent damage.

(all other nonphysical energies are 'edible' to a greater or lesser degree, and inflict no harm.)
Physical & Metaphysical

• Platinum Metal - all forms of platinum metal are anathemic to a wraith. Weapons composed of such will deal significant damage to a wraith's physical form, and cannot be directly affected by shadowmass. Non-weapon items, such as talismans, jewelry, or implements will cause harm upon contact with a wraith's shadowflesh, and barriers composed of platinum metal cannot be crossed due to the wraith's constant contact with the ground.
• Sapphire Crystals - weapons set with sapphire will do physical damage to a wraith. Other uses include placing the Blue Way-focusing crystals in shadowed locations to prevent a wraith's passage, and focusing light through a sapphire will also harm a wraith. Additionally, the shadows from sapphire-focused lights cannot be controlled by the wraith, nor can it pass through them in shadowmerged form.
• Enchantments - any items or weapons enchanted with Blue Way magic will harm a wraith's physical form on contact. The severity of the damage is reliant on the power of the enchantment and the composition of the item in question.
• Countering - when the wraith strikes as per an attack, it wills the portion of its attacking being to a solid state. Thus, when striking with claws or teeth, those parts become vulnerable to all physical laws and weapons ordinarily not capable of harming the wraith may be used to deflect or counter the assault.

(all other physical influences may be assumed to have no effect.)

[Prolix]

Very nicely written. It appears you have spent a good deal of time playing traditional table top role playing games in other's and running your own.
Since my points have been acknowledged further belaboring them would seem to enter the realm of whining. Please be certain that if what I was doing was complaining I would be calling for some kind of (unnecessary) official response and not debating the merits of the play.

My own role play is extremely limited and more in the manner of riffing a theme than in a painstakingly laid out plot. It can be seen in two posts in the Hydlaa message board has not been seen, for the most part, in the game. I feel there is a lot of possibility in a citizens advocacy group and little chance for it to stray from the settings. Even if it never rises above the status of gadfly there is lots to grouse about.

[Zan]

I'll quote myself on this topic.

This is a rather dangerous creature you have, you're claiming to be a part of settings material, having a creature that doesn't really exist in-game but just claim to have. I know it's fun to be powerful and mythical but some other players might take offense in that .. or even worse, they'll take it as an example and start thinking up more incredible background stories until we're all gods zapping others with lightning bolts

Disclaimer:

Above points are all meant to help and shouldn't be taken offensively. If you don't care about my opinion, that is fine, I won't lose any sleep over it.

I won't form any opinions on this roleplay because I haven't involved myself in it so I don't know how it's conducted. While these things are fine when they're made with the intent of entertaining others, I still prefer to stay away from these 'extravagant' RPs. I will say that the information posted above by Kieve should, in my opinion, always be given out in advance to anyone involving themselves in the roleplay.

[Kieve]

Zan - you probably should, and I encourage it. I think you'd find it a bit less mythical and extravagant with some first-hand knowledge.

Prolix - actually I've spent very little time with tabletop RPG's. My experience stems from the study of D&D monster manuals (A-D&D '98 manual, and edition 3/3.5 Manuals 1 and 3). I have sat in on a few games as an observer, and played... once, I think. Mebbe twice...

On the topic itself, the character Xathen actually stems from a very old RP back when I played Furcadia. Since the 'settings' there are more loosely defined and for the most part ignored, there were a great deal of really... odd characters. At any rate, his introduction (and the alterations I made to help him fit in), came about because I got to thinking that with regard to RP, the PS community has relatively few villains to worry about - Duraza et 'Alts' being the only ones that readily come to mind. Given that, and how interesting it was to try working him smoothly into the much more exacting lore of PlaneShift, I figured it was worth a shot.

Overall, I think I'd call this success. I do welcome anyone with constructive criticisms or ideas to speak up though.

[Saphyx]

In my own opinion, Xathen has done a great job staying in settings.  I've seen, and been in one of his Roleplays- no godmoding, you have plenty of oportunities to fight back...or run.  Which ever you're comfortable with.

P.S. Don't try to hug a wraith... Just, doesn't work.

[Kieve]

Necrothreadage, much?
But seeing as how Xathen's returned to active duty in PS, at least around Hydlaa, it's fair to give folks (at least the ones who read this) a decent heads-up on the whole bit.

And yeah, Saphyx is right - don't hug a wraith. Although it's still better than trying to hug XilliX...