The Crystal itself as a "religion"

[Suno_Regin]

That's really not a valid reason why not to have them...

Since it isn't your idea, it isn't accepted? Maybe we don't want to worship some worship-craving guy with a deformed face, a jealous guy that foolishly released power that he had no idea how to control, some nature-loving tree-girl, or a grim reaper god? I'm sure that people in real life, since they didn't like other religions, formed their own. Is it such a bad thing, such a sin against settings, to worship something else?

[Karyuu]

shorty13: The octarchy is in control You cannot form a separate entity outside the octarchy and expect it to just slide by them. Do you really think to hear "Oh yeah, sure - go right ahead. We totally don't mind a competing government alongside ours"? Moreover, you simply don't have anywhere near the number of players to make a real impact in a mutiny or rebellion (that is in proportion to the total population of Yliakum). Try to grab 200-300 people and form a separate government within one of our real life major countries. You'll get laughed at, or worse if you are perceived as a serious threat to the established peace of the land.

It just makes no sense.

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

Go worship a rock, I don't police in game.

I am telling you categorically that settings will not support this belief.

Obviously, whenever I speak "I am ruining roleplay." So have a ball.

[Raa]

* Raa gasps.

Suno's going to hell.  

I don't see why it's against the settings to have unofficial religions. That's just a total restriction on creativity. I mean, like, that guy I know worships spatulas, but it's not an official religion. And he can do it all he wants, even if spatulas aren't holy. But it's not like the government's going to keep him from worshiping spatulas, and there's no consequence for it, unless he's running for president or something.

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

Why is their such a draw to unofficial religions?

Why not use the areas and roleplay props we have given you?

Alas, why do I try?

[Raa]

Why is their such a draw to unofficial religions?

Because it's non-conformist.

Why not use the areas and roleplay props we have given you?

Because it's punk.

Alas, why do I try?

Rage against the machine!

Really though, are you saying we can't have unofficial religions?

[Waylander]

You people are so weird.  You don't want a fully fleshed out settings you want to create your own.  I swear, half of you should just go write a book

I can see crystal cults being around.  I see Xil's point and can see a bunch of reasons for there not to be a crystal cult (Everything unknown can be chalked up to the current gods so there's no real reason to make the crystal into a god).  But there'll always be crazies

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

That's really not a valid reason why not to have them...

Since it isn't your idea, it isn't accepted? Maybe we don't want to worship some worship-craving guy with a deformed face, a jealous guy that foolishly released power that he had no idea how to control, some nature-loving tree-girl, or a grim reaper god? I'm sure that people in real life, since they didn't like other religions, formed their own. Is it such a bad thing, such a sin against settings, to worship something else?

I have already given valid reasons why not to have them.

I have adopted many ideas from the community when the settings team and Talad thought they were good ones.

This is not a good idea imo.

Your issues with the current gods are fine (although I find you characterizations reductive and somewhat insulting) and . . .

it is not a sin, just against the settings, not valid RP, no features will issue from this worship.

[Karyuu]

The point is this: you can have your own crazy religion, and then ten more players have their own crazy religions, and then everyone and their walrus follows their own special gods, and Settings is sitting back going "What are we doing here again..?"

By all means, go nuts. But that kind of defeats the purpose of playing in a world that already has things for you to... well, play with.

Everyone wants to be a special snowflake.

[shorty13]

I see what you are saying, karyuu, however even the settings team cannot force people to think a certain way.  While many people to worship Laanx and Talad, It is not out of the realm of possibilities that people do not like these deities and would rather give thanks to another idea, object, person that they believe has helped guide them more in their lifetime than the popular deities. This however is only true IF the settings team does not put down a rule that says "Everyone in Yliakum has always, still does, and forever will worship these deities or none at all. No one will ever think of praising anything or anyone else."  However, that would just be unfortunate, forcing even IG hydlaans to think how you wish.  Not to mention if this were true there would certainly be several more temples around and the winch, being the scientific depot it seems to be, would not be so advanced because people everything would then be centered around a theocratic [is that a word?] way of thinking.

[Ahrimann]

Perhaps it has something to do with people not liking the current "deity" choices and not finding them interesting or fun?

The difference between everyone wanting to create their own non-official religion, worshiping spatulas and the Crystal is that the Crystal is already an integral part of the settings, not a newly created non-official lore. It's a central piece, around which everything revolves in Yliakum. People need it, the current lesser PlaneShift "gods" need it too.

I wouldn't expect any religion to just "slide by" anything. But why should it stop anyone? Black Flame is already outlawed. Doesn't it already partially stand for insanity (according to the description)? If the followers are laughed at, they can laugh back. If someone proposes something that doesn't sit well with some bloated "octarchy", they immediately get labeled as "crazies"? The crazier the better then!

And Raa, the real question is - are those magic spatulas? If so, your friend might be onto something.

I'm also wondering about something from the official settings on the web site:

They were unaware of a huge maze of tunnels present in the crust of the world, later called the Stone Labyrinths, where other creatures were already lurking in the dark.

Something had to have created those creatures. Someone or something had to have built the Stone Labyrinths, which implies a higher intelligence than simple animals.

After many generations of the Lemur had passed, Laanx wandered into a cave that was hundreds of times bigger than the one he created, where beings without a name dwelt.

What are those "beings without a name"? Obviously, neither Laanx nor Talad created them but someone or something did. Is this referring to a humanoid race of some sort? Something had to support their life too. The "cave" seems to be referring to a place, which later hosts the ten towns of Kadaikos.

Also...

Therefore, they used their powers to enlarge the niche and created the huge cave comprised of eight levels.

Was the "niche" even big enough to host a previous civilization? Because the inhabitants come across some ancient ruins in PlaneShift with structures built by a previous civilization.

Was the previous civilization without a "deity"? Laanx and Talad weren't there, so that leaves... Xiosia, Dakkru, possibly Black Flame (unless it's really a part of Laanx) and... the Crystal! The ruins don't look particularly menacing to me... Were they all Xiosia worshiping hippies?

Something to think about...

[Raa]

Perhaps it has something to do with people not liking the current "deity" choices and not finding them interesting or fun?

Or perhaps it's because we like to play crazies every once in a while. Can be quite fun.

Was the previous civilization without a "deity"? Laanx and Talad weren't there, so that leaves... Xiosia, Dakkru, possibly Black Flame (unless it's really a part of Laanx) and... the Crystal!

Only the Crystal was around back then. Xiosia just recently announced herself, Dakkru's first appearance in the Death Realm was recorded so that means it wasn't that long ago, and the Black Flame was created by the most recent civilization, I think... Probably wrong about the Black Flame thing.

[Ahrimann]

Or perhaps it's because we like to play crazies every once in a while. Can be quite fun.

Or perhaps all the time because "normal" is boring.

Black Flame was created by the most recent civilization, I think... Probably wrong about the Black Flame thing.

From the discussion mentioned in "Dakkru's Will" thread, it seems that Black Flame either stands for insanity, suicide or both. I guess that makes the most recent civilization "crazies"...

[Waylander]

As Xillix has said before, the RP is the responsibility of the Players.

Nurahk, for one, will quite happily laugh at any fool worshiping the Azure Sun.  And I'm sure he's not alone.

There will be no support for your cult though.  Settings won't actively stop you (I imagine) but, they will not exactly encourage you either.

Either way, Suno, your post is useless and offensive.  Grow - Up.

[Zan]

Silly, silly people ... you come here making a thread asking whether a religion could be valid. Note: key word is religion. Not cult, not band of crazies, no .. a commonly accepted organised thing called religion.

Then when the settings gives you an answer, you refuse to hear it and just go on doing your own thing anyway. Donari's post alone should be enough ... who goes to worship a piece of inanimate material when they have actual deities? I don't thank batteries because they give my TV remote power, I thank the person that created the batteries, the remote and the TV.

You people should drop your "I can do what I want" attitude or go write a book like Waylander said. So much is being created for us to discover and play with but what I see most people doing? They avoid it as much as possible and make up their own settings, in which they obviously have the answers and control they want. Now I can understand that, it's easier to create your own story than it is to play a role in the story of someone else. But if everyone goes to create their own stories, then eventually we're all playing past eachother, instead of with eachother. Self-made stories might be fun for you but they're definitely not always fun for those who do stick to the official settings.

It almost forces us to go out of settings ourselves or just ignore you lot. I don't want to do either.