Author Topic: Trade between players should be visible to all in sight/hearing range  (Read 4171 times)

Yanlora

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How about making it visible in Main if Players exchange items?
A system message appears to the ones trading anyways at this moment.

The message to others should however have some less precision, like:
   "<PlayerA> gave <PlayerB> Weapons and some coinage in exchange for raw materials"
   for someone trading a crafted longsword, a dagger, 2 hexa and a tria against 45 platinum ore and a silver ingot.

This in order to keep realism (can all see how many circles and tria he pushed into the other persons hand?)
The message could use the item_category, and eliminate doubles, so it could be done without giant changes to the database.

Advantages I would see in this:
   1.) there will be visible interaction between players. no more pure tell-based sales that (imho) are pretty ooc.
         Noone IRL (and especially not in the middle ages) would go into a shop and whisper in the cashiers ear what he whishes to sell or buy.
         Instead people going into a shop (not a supermarket) usually say good day followed by a statement on what they seek to buy (maybe even some smalltalk).
         Neither would such item exchange go unnoticed by other people in the shop or near the exchange.
         So I think it would add to realism. Unless the character you play would be blind.
   2.) Stealthy and sneaky exchanges of goods would have to take place in dark alleys, like sneaky things should be done.
   3.) Hopefully the messages in main would encurage Players to take the general and casual trade-talk into main as well,
         instead of hiding it in tells in order to not 'disturb' other players.
         If IRL there are others talking near you, you step away a little to give and have more privacy as well.
   4.) It also would surely add some spying capabilities into the game, as it then could indeed be seen to all around who trades with who.
         This will make it possible to IC-ly spy on other peoples trade behaviours.  \\o//This without the need of having to be telling or grouping with the ones spied on.

Disadvantages:
1.) Anyone could see who would trade with who, people who use quest runners would have to find a reason why they would get items for free..
(or take the trade to a dark alley).
2.) Someone could 'spam' the main-channel with trade messages. (but that's easier by sitting and standing up, or by dropping items and pick them up)
3.) some things I probably didn't thik about yet. feel free to add..

Overall I think it would rather add to RP then desturb it.
For slipping items to others unnoticed, there could/should be a '/givesecret' option that would use the numbers behind the pickpocket/sneaking skills.



I found a post suggesting a similar but not quite so obvious measure here:
     http://hydlaa.com/smf/index.php?topic=21377.0

Now have a go and break the idea off..   \\o//

« Last Edit: May 26, 2008, 08:13:33 pm by Yanlora »


Zwenze

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Sounds like a plan. I love the idea. Trades should be visible becouse they are visible in real life. Adds some realism. Maybe some smaller obfusication can be done, like not exactly naming numbers. Instead

Zwenze gave Yanlora 4 Beer Mugs

we can have

Zwenze gave Yanlora some Beer Mugs

Maybe also trades with NPCs should be made visible?

Sen

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I also like the idea very much.
* Sen gives $target some fears  ;D

I'm not sure how it will work out on markets, but I assume it won't be too much and the ones standing not in sight to the ones trading should be able to ignore it.
I also think it will be good for the roleplay in various situations and remain in hope that this will come soon.

Sen
.....also a saddle that won't pinch the tail. One day!

Candy

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Quote
1.) there will be visible interaction between players. no more pure tell-based sales that (imho) are pretty ooc.
         Noone IRL (and especially not in the middle ages) would go into a shop and whisper in the cashiers ear what he whishes to sell or buy.
         

I dunno, the drug dealers in high school bartered in whispers sometimes. But this is  :offtopic:
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piprees

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Playing devils advocate here

Can you imagine the chat screen and player screen at a market?

one word - flooooooooooooooooood
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Zwenze

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Playing devils advocate here

Can you imagine the chat screen and player screen at a market?

one word - flooooooooooooooooood
I would love it if it would have been that way but I think that in the flea market there were less then 100 tradings going on, an that in roughly 3 hours.

Taniquetil

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I like the idea other than, yes it could flood at large functions. Maybe two players trading could have some kind of symbol recognizing that they are trading and if you wish to watch, you may examine it. Because maybe i don't really care what X gives Y but i really want to see what W gives Z... Just a thought.
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piprees

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That would make more sense, because if your in a supermaket for example, you dont look at what everyone else is buying - maybe the person standing next to you, if your really that bothered about what type of cat food there picking up.

I have these horrible visions of a runescape filled player screen with people all screaming "SELLING XYZ !!!!! <////> BEST PRICES - NO NOOBS"
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Sen

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I agree generally to the thought that spamming could become a problem, but I seriously doubt that enough trading is actually goind on to cause a problem. We can take the flea market as extreme example and as Zwenze said even there it is not problem at all.
So the flooding looks for me like a theoretical issue that is not likely to happen.

Sen

#edit# Typo...
.....also a saddle that won't pinch the tail. One day!

Mrokii

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the question is: Why should I care?

As someone suggested it should rather be done in a way that I can watch a deal only if I want to (don't know how that could be realized though). I think the problem isn't flooding, but that it isn't exactly realistic if I "hear" about each and every deal that goes on around me. In real life, even on a market, I usually would not care too much what all others around me do, so why should I need to be bothered with that info in PS?

Zwenze

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the question is: Why should I care?

As someone suggested it should rather be done in a way that I can watch a deal only if I want to (don't know how that could be realized though). I think the problem isn't flooding, but that it isn't exactly realistic if I "hear" about each and every deal that goes on around me. In real life, even on a market, I usually would not care too much what all others around me do, so why should I need to be bothered with that info in PS?

The point is that even if you dont care you see those trades. Lets take drug dealers as an example. They offer forbidden goods and their custtoemrs dont want to be associated with them. Because of that they dont trade drugs in front of a polica station for example. Its just to obvious that if someone takes some money and offers some "sustances" that there is something odd going on.

In Yliakum you can be a drug dealer and sell your offerings under the nose of Jafecra, as no one sees you are trading at all. You can trade back and forward and do most sunny stuff. And no one gets a clue. Thats a bit unrealistic.

And in real life its visible that someone is trading stuff to another person, even if you care or not. Maybe you dont realize as you dont pay attention, but its the same with dropped items for example.

Yanlora

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Yay! a discussion..
Well spam might be a problem. I also find the drop_item spam a little annoying. It is far more frequent then trade spam will ever be i fear.. and also the x sits down at y.
especially if someone wishes to make 'kniebeugen' near me.

Like I said.. rip it if you like..

I do indeed like the suggested option of  having the possibility to 'fokus' on some trade (or any action) to get more detail.. nice idea.

Zwenze

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Hmm, how about if you dont have one of the traders focused you only get a message they have traded. If you have one of them focused you get some clue what they have traded.

Zwenze gave Yanlora some tria and received some short swords.

Nikodemus

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About flooding.

In MB the communications window was divided into two. System and talking. It was good idea and would work right now just fine with little change.
By clicking a button you can roll down the system window part, so you arent forced to look at it all the time if you dont need to. It ca be done in several ways. For example it has fixed size of 5 lines and resizing the comm window you increase only the lines for usual talking. Or both parts of the window can be resized differently. Or something else. 1) is very good 2) is even better but harder. 
The current customization allowing to inculde system in the main tab is a way out, but it is kind of "permanent". You can't change it on the fly. You set it once and leave it, because setting it differently all the time is just too long.
Of course i'm not proposing to withdraw any feature. Just add a new one for better awarness of the world



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