Crafting or the 'New Realism'

[XWNI]

This recent crafting change really is the final straw,   I'm out, my characters may be checked now and again, but are now essentially abandoned.

All these changes to planeshift, in the name of increasing realism are horribly misguided.     @Devs, shame on you

This is a game damnit, no matter how hard you try, it's still a game, and the characters are not real, no amount of RP will make them so.   More importantly, I have a finite amount of time available, a 24 hour day, during which I have to "do stuff", and can't simply sit around all day wasting time on a game that's going nowhere.

X

[Akkaido Kivikar]

Gees mate no need to get too angry over a few fixes.

Brilliant blacksmiths are very rare. I'd hate to see Planeshift flooded in them.

[weltall]

not to say it but shield crafting was always done this way this is just making all coherent. Actually we have lowered the times to heat the materials which wasn't done in the shield crafting

[BlueScreenJunky]

I remember that game, Sapiens (which dates back to 1986 lol...) in which you could create weapons out of silex, and it was a minigame which required you to follow the outline with your mouse or something.
Anyway, I think forging, mining etc. should eventually be done through some kind of minigames so that :
-It will be less boring than clicking repeatedly
-It will require you to focus on what you're doing, which is realistic (even if the minigame in itself is not)
-Bots won't be able to do it.
-You'll be able to do it faster or better if you're actually good at the minigame, and not only because of your character's level.


PS : Just my 2 cents, sorry if it's already been discussed, I haven't come here in 4 years and didn't feel like reading all my unread messages ^^

[Bamko]

in real life, Magic does not exist, people DIE if they can not eat enough, and many people lead lives of quiet desperation.  We come here to get away from some of that.

Also, In Real Life, I like doing work.  A hobby I play with sometimes is ropemaking.  Twine, cordage.  Whatever.  Sure, would be BORING to make a clickable process out of it, but nice to keep hands moving, cordage twisting, interlocking.

Point is, PS seems to be moving away from being fun.  Add in a 1/3 second (seems longer lately) lag due to ping times, and the process is more like this:

Click on blade, wait for it to realize you clicked on it, move it and place in forge.  opps, you dropped it, due to lag or something... man this thing is clunky... ok.. pick it up again.... ok.. in forge... ok, there is the message finally, pick it up.. quick.... dont want to over-heat it... whew... got it... now place it in inventory... ok.. now put it in hand....

yes, it is still easier than making swords in real life, but understand, you get to REALLY see the metal glow, you get to pound on REAL steel, and you get a REAL blade when you are done.  And unless you are drinking a case of beer before you try to craft, you wont be as clumsy and as "shaky" as we are ingame.

Realism is nice, to a point.  I am known as being a grinder who thinks it should take MORE effort to level up EVERYTHING, but, my dear fellows, Can we try to make it a little fun along the way?

I want to make swords for my guild.  I have the dull blades, and I had time to make them over the weekend, and could not FORCE myself to log in to craft them.  I watched re-runs and actually did some dirty jobs I was neglecting instead.  I will finish those blades, but looking forward to it as I would look forward to a home lobotomy.  And no way in heck will I spend the time to work and rework the blades to tweak a bit more quality into them. 

So, until it is FUN, I will probably not be playing as much.  But that has been my position for a while.  Just commenting here as a desparate pleading

Want to make it harder to level, no problem, but please, place a higher priority on making it FUN-er?  Sure not everyone like Desktop tower defense, but hey, a lot of people do, for example.

or you can keep making it more realistic, (realisiticly less fun) and you will find many will find other things to do with their time to escape from THIS reality.  heck, Tonight options? finish up those blades, or pick up dog poop and trim my Old English sheepdog's butt.   Tough call.   Doubt I will be on tonight....   Seriously.

[Madoring]

I think its cool.  I'm hoping that this will actually make some people shy away from crafting, as well as raise the value of swords (even like q200s).  I think that crafters deserve more Trias for slaving over their work.
Hopefully this will make it harder to bot as well.

[Karyuu]

Ah, but making something harder to bot does not necessarily make it enjoyable, and a game should be fun first and foremost. In addition, the rarity of something should never come from a lack of enthusiasm for trying. These are very bad arguments to use. But hey, if the team says they'll look into it, they will.

In the meantime, you could always make Wishlist threads with suggestions of more interesting crafting systems.

[Elady]

The new change doesn't affect the making of a sword, unless you like to hammer a lot of the blade before making the finished product. If I'm just making a straight sword without hammering nothing has changed except the times to heat the blade is a bit shorter now. It is the endless hammering on a blade for sword making practice that takes longer now.

[Woruell]

The new change doesn't affect the making of a sword, unless you like to hammer a lot of the blade before making the finished product. If I'm just making a straight sword without hammering nothing has changed except the times to heat the blade is a bit shorter now. It is the endless hammering on a blade for sword making practice that takes longer now.

I have to state that not only the procedure has changed but apparently also the ratio quality/skill. i used to be able to make perfect blades within 1 or 2 efforts. Now i'm not even able to do this within 20 efforts or more. (to be precise, i haven't made a single one since the change). I don't see the point in reducing people's skills. From my point of view this is very frustrating. I don't know how you all feel but i'm asking myself if it  makes sense to spend loads of time trying to become a good smith (or something else) if you can be downgraded to almost a beginner from one day to another. I understand the reasons for changing the procedure (more realistic and less "botable") but i can't see a point in reducing the skills. Maybe someone can explain this to me.

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

We're making efforts to make the crafted weapons more valuable as well.

You have to have patience while we balance the system.

[Elady]

With my fairly low skill levels ( 34 sword making and 40 blacksmith) I was able to make a 300Q saber today and it didn't take me that long to make it. The average quality of my swords is down but it felt good to make a 300Q sword again.

[Prolix]

my skills are quite low, ~20 bs and less for the various weapons. I have never made a weapon much better than 200 but routinely get 130+ with only the standard A,B,D blade, quench, sharpen, assemble. Is it really realistic to expect a beginner smith to make weapons so much better than the store bought ones? Who makes those anyway? If people can make max quality blades with the skill levels available now where is the industry going to go in the future? Is the max level already up to the 200 that matches the other skill types? It seems to me it is already too easy.

[matz05]

I agree with the minigame idea. That would solve several problems at once: monotony, bottability, etc.

Please?

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

Quite possible, but a long long ways off.

[Mythryndel]

I haven't posted here in months... and I also haven't played in months. I do keep checking for updates, but non have been released, so I feel it is safe to say that things are the same as when I last logged in). But I feel I should post here... as the references to watching movies while crafting blades is something I have publicly admitted to doing. The honest problems I have with crafting weapons are:

1. BORING. There is no other word for it. Each step may be incredibly simple and non-time consuming. However, once you get past level 10 or so it becomes hopelessly boring to make any real progress towards the next level and increased quality.

2. Market is unwilling to pay for low quality blades. This is a chicken and egg problem, and I have observed it being better on EZPCUSA, but the fact that people only want best quality blades means that I cannot even earn enough trias to keep training crafting without resorting to mining (regardless of NPC direction to get a steady supply of ore established). If I had to actually pay for ore AND training... I wouldn't make it to level 10 without going bankrupt. I wouldn't make it to level 5 without going bankrupt if I had to craft blades start to finish without hammering the same blade to train. You also can't sell to a NPC for anything close to what the cost of materials even... 1 stock goes for approx 800 - 1000 trias. A Sabre that requires 1 Stock and 2 ingots... would then run you on the high end 1200 trias. You can sell to Harnquist for approx 150 trias.

3. Too random. I have had materials that I take forever to get up to near Q200 each... only to have a blade combined to be less than Q100. I have had the same blade and worked it over and over... one time it can go from Q87 to Q151... other times I have had one go from Q142 to Q38. I have not seen an appreciable amount of stability in quality with training to approx lvl 15... maybe this happens later, but unless something solves the problem of crafting being both unprofitable and boring... I won't be personally finding out.

There has to be a fine line between realism and fun... un-scriptable and unplayable... I don't envy any of the developers in this conflict. But I have not been able to bring myself to train weapons crafting to even double digits on EZPCUSA because at times I would rather remove my own fingernails.

I have suggested, and I don't know if it is technically possible, that there be quests that require you to craft weapons... possibly of a certain quality. Give crafting some purpose other than to have people shun your work because it isn't perfect or grinding until it is.

For the record, When I was crafting and watching movies... It was on the same PC and I had a window partially covering the PS window so I could still see my character and associated messages. I was still chatting if anyone came by and talked to me... etc. But, to be completely honest about it, If i was actively engaged in conversation it would take me twice to three times as long to train my next level because I would forget to click things... or I would overheat things and have to start over at the quench tank, etc.

I guess it is now time to go back to the shadows and patiently wait for what is coming in the next release...