Obnoxious Magic Users

[Timmothy Perriwinkle]

Here begins another whiner post. Enjoy.

So basically, I just got finished ranting on IRC about all the magic users in Planeshift annoying the hell out of me. So I'll just go ahead and list of the things I'm whining about.

Firstly, the obnoxious amount of types of magic. You'll just be walking about the sewers or nonsense and random character will come out and basically RP realm 4 spells in at least 3-4 different ways. Wtf, is all I can say. Magic is supposed to be just that--Magic. It isn't supposed to be a universal thing that everyone knows, nor is it supposed to be like trading cards (GOTTA COLLECT 'EM ALL GUYS).

Next, it's the age-old stats backing RP argument. Honestly, I'm completley neutral on this. You have the stats to back it, good for you. If not, I'll still take it. The key here is regarding settings. Like the above point, even moreso when you have NO training to back it, don't RP that you're a master of every way. Ash Ketchum has been training Pokemon for what, 12 years now? And his Pikachu can still get beat up in battle by an ordinary trainer. The show wouldn't be interesting if his Pikachu was level 9001 and annihilated everything all the time by knowing every attack ever.

Lastly, I'd just like to say, because everyone likes magic, it's honestly a lot of fun to RP with combat, but the point is it's supposed to be a challenge, for you especially. If you insist on using magic, learn one way. Just one. Don't say, "Oh I'll use a spell from here and there". No, just learn one, and it's even more fun finding the weaknesses and strengths of said way and creatively applying it with other combat in order to defeat the megaevils o/. Honestly, IMHO, if everyone that was megapwn in seven ways (that's right. I'm sure someone has RPd being a master of seven ways) simply downsized to being mediocre to strong in a single way, everything would be more fun.

That's basically it. The purpose of this isn't really to invoke discussion about this, it's more to just say to a few key people whom particularly annoy me with above issues. Rather than single them out I hope they read this, and most importantly, stoppit.

[zanzibar]

Well, according to the settings, Talad gave the people of Yliakum glyphs in order to make their lives easier.  I suspect that everyone knows a little magic, even if it's simple spells like starting a cooking fire or seeing on a dark path at night.  I would enjoy seeing simple spells added to the game.  Perhaps even spells that have no effect save for a visual one.

I think what you're describing can be called godmoding, if they're claiming to have magical abilities that they don't actually possess.  The alternative is that they're roleplaying characters who are dishonest braggarts, which is also a genuine possibility.

Hopefully in the future, you'll have to pick and choose which ways to excel in.  Being limited to specific quest paths won't accomplish this since people can always buy glyphs from other players.  Making training exceptionally hard won't accomplish this either since we have players who are exceptionally good at grinding levels.  But I'm sure some creative solution will be found in the future.

[Timmothy Perriwinkle]

Honestly, in my eyes anyway, this problem doesn't require a "creative solution". Players just need to realize that they're ruining the fun of others and most probably themselves by godmodding magic. Code changes won't fix anything with the issue of players RPing that they can do uber magics in all seven ways without any training in any of the six. It's solely on the player to fix this issue and that was the point of this post, because I'd hoped that the message would get out to a few key people who set the example that it's okay to do this to the youg'uns.

[Prolix]

Here is a thought, when you are running around the sewer you are in the realm of the black flame and you mught well consider it as running into madmen. Certainly no self respecting powerful mage wanders through the muck if he can help it.

[Akkaido Kivikar]

I thought we'd all agreed not to whine and all get along.

[zanzibar]

I thought we'd all agreed not to whine and all get along.

We did.  In fact I think we agree to it every six months or so.

[Quq Leque]

And Pikachu sucks

[Janner]

 Well I hope you are not moaning about players like Janner and helpful sorts that go in there to help new by healing them, so they can get what they need faster and safer.

[PhoenixRizin]

I do agree that often the magic RP can get a little out of hand, and setting boundaries makes it immensely more fun. But since there is no way to guarantee that every player will limit themselves, the only way to find people to RP with is to experiment and ignore anyone you think makes themselves too powerful. Read character descriptions as well. Some people are mages. Its what they do. They have a right to be powerful. Some are swordsman and will not be as strong in magic.

For my own character, I made him a weapons expert, so I decided that since he trained with blades most of his life, his magic should not be godlike. So while he could probably outmatch most with a sword, he is not gonna use Dark Way to obliterate you. But since magic is practiced to some degree by everyone, I figured he might know some crystal way at least to heal himself after a battle. Again, not a crystal way expert, but just enough to serve his purpose. As a smithy, he knows a little red way, but again he's not going to win a battle solely with fire spells.

So for anyone RPing magic, think how it fits in their lives and see the degree they'd use each way. And its ok to be a master magician with super powerful spells, but be fair...if you've studied magic that much you should not also be a master axeman.

And one final suggestion that I found made things fair as well...if you do use magic, it takes time to charge, so depending on the power of your characters spell, make a rule for yourself that if you are gonna pull out the SUPERDEATHRAYHADOUKEN spell, it may take a few seconds to charge up, giving your opponent the opportunity to either duck, dodge, counter-attack, or become a deer in headlights and shout "OH NOOOOOOO!!!!" before a messy and painful death.

[Under the moon]

Magic in PS is like Tools in real life. They are exactly that in PS, Tools. Each Glyph or Glyph combo does a certain thing, like a tool. Yes, you can use a tool for something it is not intended for, like using a screwdriver for a prybar, but it is still similar in nature.

So, why compare glyphs to wrenches and hammers? Just as with tools in real life, anyone can pick up a basic glyph (as compared to a power drill or impact hammer) in PS and learn to use it with a little effort. Magic is nothing special in PS. Many are just simple tools. They have a purpose. Pick one up and pull the trigger and they power up and do what they were designed to do.

Combining glyphs makes more complex spells, just as combining tools makes more complex machines, like lawnmowers, guns, and cars. Almost any person can be taught in time to use more complex machines. The same goes for glyphs. But the same rules apply. Once you 'start' the spell, it does as it was intended. Daemion Arrows makes arrows that always fly out the same, a car drives when you push the peddle. Same concept, same dangers if you do it wrong.

Higher level magic can be compared to more an more complex machines. CNC lathes, Space shuttles, VCR clocks, etc. But they still only do what they were designed to do. A n-th level Dark Way master can't make a Glyph do other than it was intended any more than a Shuttle pilot could reenter orbit in a way the craft was not intended, or use it as a micron microscope.

In the same respect, without the tools that make a Craftsman a Craftsman in real life, he can not do his craft. A Mage without his glyphs has NO power. You can not pound nails with your bare hands. You can not fly into orbit without a Shuttle, no matter how good a pilot you are.

To sum up: You can not do magic without the glyphs. You can not do magic the glyph was not specifically designed to do. Magic does not make your eyes change color or glow, especially red.

[dragnoor]

Hehe can i post now?
Magic/Magery is hard sought, hard earned. Only a few true mages. The balance is right. in terms of magery. Some of the spells are being worked on to right the wrongs.
But essentailly Mages are Contrite & arrogant - They can be.

[zanzibar]

Hehe can i post now?
Magic/Magery is hard sought, hard earned. Only a few true mages. The balance is right. in terms of magery. Some of the spells are being worked on to right the wrongs.
But essentailly Mages are Contrite & arrogant - They can be.

Hmm.  How does it follow that one should be arrogant?  I'm not saying you're right or wrong, I just don't see how you got from A to B on that one.  RPing an arrogant character has caused me trouble in the past so I tend to avoid it these days.

[kaerli2]

As far as Kaerli goes...she is a generalist when it comes to magic, albeit not a great mage.  Her goal is this: know at least one offensive spell in each Way...she's already two-thirds of the way there!  And, dealing with Glyphs and other things:
a) if magic outside the realm of the Glyphs doesn't exist, why is it illegal?
b) Kaerli (for more reasons than one) tends to be somewhat resistant to the effects of spells (she's not immune to them naturally, it just takes quite a bit of work to bring her down).  Between that and her VERY aggressive (you'll see this in RPduels mostly, due to the b0rked-ness of combat WRT PvP atm) fighting style, she can bring down a mage by disrupting most of his casts and taking or dodging what few slip through.

Advice to mages: 1) don't be suprised if people pick on you while you are trying to get a spell off
2) don't use an ub3rspell, because such things often don't turn out to be so ub3r after all :p
3) You shouldn't be able to tell that someone is a mage by looking at them, unless they are one of those crazy folk who put their Glyphs on display...

[zanzibar]

The other gods have magic, and they were using magic before Talad made the glyphs.  So glyphs without magic must be possible on some level, even if it requires that you are a god.  Unless the gods are using glyphs as well.

[Akkaido Kivikar]

3) You shouldn't be able to tell that someone is a mage by looking at them, unless they are one of those crazy folk who put their Glyphs on display...

I beg to differ. Mages always have ways of being noticed. Whether carrying a staff rather than a weapon, wearing simple or elaborate cloaks rather than armour, a notable amount of literature hanging out of a pocket or backsack....

There's always the tell-tale wand too.