The Bataireacht Bout - Rules, Comments and Discussion

[Sangwa]

(...) I don't think that blocked/missed/failed/or dodged attacks should count. (...)

I agree with this blokes, otherwise you're needlessly disregarding the system.

Also, instead of two jumps, the fighters could start seated (as some sort of ritual) and rise once ready. Not sure if works in this situation, but jumpy characters make me uneasy.

Anyway, this whole deal sounds delicious. Way to go!

[Bonifarzia]

I agree with this blokes, otherwise you're needlessly disregarding the system.

Fairplay is my first priority, and in this case, I do not see a way to enforce fair conditions without disregarding combat mechanics. In the early planning phase of the event, I considered items of category pole associated with the not yet trainable spear & pole-arms skill, but this is not true.

I like the suggestion to sit down rather than to jump... it is slow, but at least not an obvious OoC element.

[Sangwa]

Fairplay should also have into account the time a person has spent on training... It's a bit disrespectful to disregard the time people spend on making their character consistent with the game mechanics.

If the character misses, or if his opponent dodges, or blocks the blow with his weapon, it should make the game last longer. If it hits without damage, or if is defended by an armour part (do not know if that happens) it should still count to end the combat.

This is hardly a decisive aspect though, I'm merely mentioning it for consistency sake. This event is top-notch stuff and I'll try to participate once I get back to my good laptop.

[Caraick]

I have to agree with Sangwa here...  Even with juiced up stats and skills, the amount of dodges and blocks will not be that significant, as proved during the very first test run of the Bout.  With no armor, regardless of your skill level, you will make damage on the person if you make contact.  That being said, there will be a few hits that may be dodge, blocked, or missed, but so what? That's part of the combat system, and has just as much to do with luck as it does with the stats/skills. 


If the whole spirit of the event is to make contact, then ignoring the game mechanics seems a bit unfair.  I love this event, and I think it's a fantastic way to hone your dueling skills without worrying about being hopelessly out-classed by players with much higher stats or skills then your own.  That being said, I enjoyed the first event when it was fought armor-less, and dodged, missed, or blocked hits were treated as actual dodged, missed, or blocked hits, not changed or ignored for the sake of the event.  Stick with the game mechanics on this! This event is fantastic, and has a lot of great things going for it, including that it can be done with the game mechanics, without having to worry about being duly unfair.

Just my thoughts on the matter, keep this event up, Boni, I'll see you at the next Bout!

[Bonifarzia]

Thanks for the comments. I try my best not to ignore this, so I did a little test.

I gave up collecting statistically significant data soon... you see why.
I think the data set is small enough that I can post this without giving spoilers, but the message should be clear enough.



Probability check in defensive stances at maxed stats and without armor:

rank	0	150
hits	8	52
dodged	41	0
misses	4	0
blocked	4	1
total	57	53

In other stances, you can observe some shifts in above categories, but the overall chance to hit looks even worse.

Therefore, no rule changes for now.

[Bonifarzia]

The Quinthal Bataireacht Bout

Review

First of all, I would like to thank everyone who attended to the Quinthal Bataireacht Bout. Again, the duels have been very sporting and fair. I honestly hope everyone who participated enjoyed the games and the spectators had some entertaining fights to watch.
Although it was wonderful to see enough brave fighters register to keep the games going for astounding twenty-two rounds, two of my personal goals have not been achieved. The newly introduced and announced voting for the grand newcomer award and betting games were both not successful due to a lack of interest and competition between trainee fighters. Nevertheless, I will try to do better for these next time.

I would like to congratulate Chessire for her exceptional performance and provide the updated statistics of the games.


Summary

round	victorious	defeated	streak
1	Kisoji	Xitop
2	Kisoji	Caraick	2
3	Chessire	Kisoji
4	Chessire	Gilyare	2
5	Chessire	Xitop	3
6	Chessire	Glaciusor	4
7	Chessire	Caraick	5
8	Chessire	Kisoji	6
9	Gilyare	Chessire
10	Xitop	Gilyare
11	Xitop	Glaciusor	2
12	Caraick	Xitop
13	Kisoji	Caraick
14	Kisoji	Glaciusor	2
15	Chessire	Kisoji
15	Chessire	Caraick	2
17	Chessire	Glaciusor	3
18	Chessire	Kisoji	4
19	Glaciusor	Chessire
20	Ova	Glaciusor
21	Ova	Fay	2
22	Ova	Glaciusor	3

Statistics

Participant	Victories	Rounds
Chessire	10	12
Kisoji	4	8
Ova	3	3
Xitop	2	5
Caraick	1	5
Gilyare	1	3
Glaciusor	1	7
Fay	0	1

My special thanks go to Luzino, who again did a great job assisting me with the administration of the games, and to Haraun, who patiently waited for people to participate in the betting games.

[Maisent]

Wow Chessire huh? she didn't look like the dueling type but looks like shes pretty good (Or maybe practicing claymors against gobbles helped timing  )


And i've been hearing bad things about this kisoji fellow..

[LigH]

You see - it is all about agility, timing, tactics, and ... fun.

[novacadian]

Stick with the game mechanics on this!

For what it is worth, the lack of respect for game mechanics is what kept Venorel from participating.

- Nova

[Bonifarzia]

... the lack of respect for game mechanics ...

If you are consequent with this opinion, you should also condemn any sort of RP fights, where an untrained character has a chance to defeat a maxed, heavily armored axe wielder.

And if you want to enjoy the power of your superior skill ranks, join any traditional tournament or have fun with some spontaneous use of player vs player mechanics. I do so for sure.
Anyways, I do not want to fill this thread with such a discussion. My ideas and intentions should be well clarified and justified. If you have a suggestion or complaint, support it with a meaningful reason.

Thanks.
And may the light guide you.

[Sen]

* Sen can't resist to edit his signature

[novacadian]

* Sen can't resist to edit his signature

My apologies if my comment's suggestion was not obvious. It was to mean to adhere to the game mechanics. If that is off the table then my implied suggestion is mute. Venorel has participated in the last Champion's Cup with no hope of winning; her goal only being to use up all the potions which she had brought. That goal was not with the intent to enjoy the power of her superior skill ranks. She was highly outranked in that regard.

As to the RP battles, if dice were employed then it is one of my favourite rpg scenarios.... David and Goliath. Without dice usage, then you are correct, it would not move me much at all; assuming you are not talking about a non-developed character which is supposed to have RPed implied skills and strengths.

Maybe employing the /roll command would be a middle ground option. Hope that suggestion is not talking off the table.

- Nova

[Sen]

  My signature change was not targeted at anyone in particular

[Maisent]

btw I agree that blocks/dodges shouldn't count because in normal fighting that would not count as "Damage" to the other person.
Also to make it fair i think players should not wear armor.
So when they get hurt, whether its 1 hp damage or 500, we know that it was not a dodge/ block. If dodges are counted, people could just go on auto attack and rush towards their enemy without any skill, and you wouldn't be able to move back since the arena is small + some guy is chasing you on auto attack, so you have no where to go to time your attack, or to escape.

Also there wouldn't be any use for timing, and /stop attack. Because it wont matter if you got hit in full defensive mode or bloody mode, Whenever you are just hit, or bashed at, the game stops

[Bonifarzia]

Introduction of this topic updated;
Some comment to the Quinthal Bout added;



Maisent, I had the impression that people with good timing skills had a clear advantage. It is true that switching stances will not be of any use with the current rules, but I disagree that stopping and reinitializing attacks won't help. It was no problem at all to distinguish the different attack events as a juror during the rehearsal, and of course armor was not allowed at that time.  Once more, I would like to remind you on the core concept of the event...

... untrained characters are encouraged to challenge skilled warriors in equal and fair conditions...

... and the little dataset previously posted where one character has less than 2% chance to hit and the other one more than 98%.