Indicators above NPCs who have quest information

[MirceaKitsune]

My first post on the forum, so hello to everyone I found about PlaneShift this spring and played it for a while. Tried 0.5.4 today and love the new changes I seen so far... great work

Anyway, I have a request for a feature that I'd like to see most at the moment... regarding quests. In my opinion, this could turn completing quests from a nightmare to something much more pleasant for some people. Can NPC's have symbols above their heads when they have a quest available for you and / or you need to see them in order to complete or continue a quest?

I'm thinking about the way I seen this done in WoW. NPC's who have a quest available have a yellow ! above their heads, while those who you need to see as part of a quest have a yellow ? instead. Not saying "do it here cuz that's how it's done in WoW". I just wish for this because the biggest pain for me was finding NPC for quests. You need to know all of them by name and location in a big world, and where to go to for each mission. I have a lot of quests on my list that I have no idea who to visit to complete (and without guidance from some nice players when I was a newbie, I would have never gotten Winch access ).

A symbol above NPCs would make this a much smaller pain imo. Every time you're roaming around you'd see a marked NPC and say "oh I can stop here to complete a quest on the way". Or see who has a quest for you without having to click, for the other half of this feature. The only downside is that this can make quests less challenging. But in my opinion, having to find and click NPC's by their names in such a large world is more than challenging enough. I am aware of the walk-throughs on the web too... but I'm not sure how fun it is to complete a quest if you have to read its solution on a web site instead of just playing.

So yeah. If this feature is ever considered, I'd highly support it and would be grateful for it

[Earowo]

My first post on the forum, so hello to everyone I found about PlaneShift this spring and played it for a while. Tried 0.5.4 today and love the new changes I seen so far... great work

Anyway, I have a request for a feature that I'd like to see most at the moment... regarding quests. In my opinion, this could turn completing quests from a nightmare to something much more pleasant for some people. Can NPC's have symbols above their heads when they have a quest available for you and / or you need to see them in order to complete or continue a quest?

tsk tsk tsk. You should have been In Ps back when I started 2 years ago, back in 4.03 you had to type out EVERYTHING you wanted to say, if you lost track of which npc you needed to see, the whole quests was pretty much screwd over if you didnt have notes, if you had been around then, you would know what we have now is a bigtime luxery

[Candy]

Symbols above the heads would go against immersion, but I suppose this could be done on EZPCUSA. Finding another way to go about it would be nifty, though - perhaps an NPC calling out to you when you pass within a certain range? "Hey, [your character's name], did you get those [items] yet?" or "So, what did [other NPC] say?"

The mechanic already seems to be there with the guards in Hydlaa; all that needs to be done is make it dependent on which quest you're on.

[MirceaKitsune]

tsk tsk tsk. You should have been In Ps back when I started 2 years ago, back in 4.03 you had to type out EVERYTHING you wanted to say, if you lost track of which npc you needed to see, the whole quests was pretty much screwd over if you didnt have notes, if you had been around then, you would know what we have now is a bigtime luxery

Wow, that does sound like it was even more difficult. I don't think I could have made many quests without guidance at that stage Still, even if it was harder in the past, I do personally believe the aim is going toward a reasonable difficulty for all players. So even if it was worse in the past, I think that doesn't mean it shouldn't try being better in the future, imho.

Symbols above the heads would go against immersion, but I suppose this could be done on EZPCUSA. Finding another way to go about it would be nifty, though - perhaps an NPC calling out to you when you pass within a certain range? "Hey, [your character's name], did you get those [items] yet?" or "So, what did [other NPC] say?"

The mechanic already seems to be there with the guards in Hydlaa; all that needs to be done is make it dependent on which quest you're on.

That sounds like an useful alternative. Could be used by both bots who are waiting for you on a quest, and bots who have a quest available for you (who could yell "hey, can you do something for me please?"). I'm not completely sure about this method however. It would require new texts for all quests, which would probably be a lot of work. And it's possible for players to confuse them with general NPC dialogues in some areas, that they don't even read (like the guards in Hyd who drive you mad about sheathing your weapons). But this sounds pretty good, and would preserve the immersion as well. Can even work together with the symbols idea, so both could exist.

Symbols could harm the immersion though, that is true. Although they can be made an option, so players who find such markers unrealistic could just disable them (I'm sure some would want that so it would be ok as a setting imo). Perhaps a discrete aura (or better off a wisp) above such NPCs would help more than a symbol too. I'd go for the idea of a discrete colored whisp really. I'll try to see if I can mockup a screenshot with something that would look nice, out of curiosity

[EDIT] Well, here are two quick ideas. Of course something much better can be done, and a bit more discrete: http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/6072/shot140.jpg

[Vakachehk]

symbols on top of NPCs heads, I wouldn't mind if it shows there only after seeing someone, as that could be the indicator of showing you where someone is, that the last NPC told you. E.g. Harquist tells you to go see Trasok, Trasok has a symbol on his head because Harnquist told you information of where and what Trasok would look like.

[MirceaKitsune]

symbols on top of NPCs heads, I wouldn't mind if it shows there only after seeing someone, as that could be the indicator of showing you where someone is, that the last NPC told you. E.g. Harquist tells you to go see Trasok, Trasok has a symbol on his head because Harnquist told you information of where and what Trasok would look like.

That would make sense. Although a NPC that gives you a quest almost always tells you the name of who you need to see. Since you can see the floating names above all NPCs, I think this does apply and you'd know who to visit.

Anyway, I photoshopped two icons today to be used for this purpose, and posted a feature request on the tracker here: http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/flyspray/index.php?do=details&task_id=4798 Here is another mockup using the icons I made (I included the source so anyone can modify and make them better if they wish): http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/7513/npcquestinformationicon.jpg

[Maisent]

symbols on top of NPCs heads, I wouldn't mind if it shows there only after seeing someone, as that could be the indicator of showing you where someone is, that the last NPC told you. E.g. Harquist tells you to go see Trasok, Trasok has a symbol on his head because Harnquist told you information of where and what Trasok would look like.

That would make sense. Although a NPC that gives you a quest almost always tells you the name of who you need to see. Since you can see the floating names above all NPCs, I think this does apply and you'd know who to visit.

Anyway, I photoshopped two icons today to be used for this purpose, and posted a feature request on the tracker here: http://www.hydlaaplaza.com/flyspray/index.php?do=details&task_id=4798 Here is another mockup using the icons I made (I included the source so anyone can modify and make them better if they wish): http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/7513/npcquestinformationicon.jpg

Looks great! I was thinking of a bigger sign and no background, just the "!" or "?" and its transparent, its almost like floating over their head like a red shadow. I would edit it and make it but i do not have gimp or photoshop in this cimputer.

[Maisent]

Symbols above the heads would go against immersion, but I suppose this could be done on EZPCUSA. Finding another way to go about it would be nifty, though - perhaps an NPC calling out to you when you pass within a certain range? "Hey, [your character's name], did you get those [items] yet?" or "So, what did [other NPC] say?"

The mechanic already seems to be there with the guards in Hydlaa; all that needs to be done is make it dependent on which quest you're on.

So is names above the head immersion too? what about those little simble things when you right click on an item or a player?

[MirceaKitsune]

So is names above the head immersion too? what about those little simble things when you right click on an item or a player?

I was thinking just about that, really. It goes against immersion to see floating texts above people / monsters, but at the same time it's extremely needed for most players. Same can be said about having a HUD on your screen imo (like the chat area). Which is why I believe such things are ok as long as they stay options, and people can disable them if they feel it makes PS less realistic.

[verden]

just the "!" or "?"

Instead of copying WoW, I would think it would be possible to add a color shading behind the name label to indicate quest status. That way you could turn it off with the labels.

[Maisent]

Or other than having a !, or a ? have like a star or some other symblos... also tamper with the colouring. This is a very good idea since noobs in the tutorial get very confused witht eh quest, even I get confused now and then.

My suggestion would  be  to take a symbol and change the color, green for a quest red meaning you need to talk to that person, maybe yellow is a color to know that that's the final stage of the quest or soemthing.

[Candy]

While the names and symbols aren't really immersive either, they're kind of necessary unless and until someone comes up with a workaround. One of the blurbs that shows up when you first log in implies that when characters are more customizable the names above the heads will probably be gone (I assume description boxes will probably still be in place, though, unless they end up customizable to the degree where we can show bandages, limps, makeup, et cetera, as well as a an OOC way of finding out the name so we don't have to do something ridiculous like report abusive players to the GMs by asking them who they are IC or describing their avatar). I have names on mouse-over, myself, and find that it helps.

It isn't so much a matter of making everything strictly realistic as it is finding the balance between immersion and keeping the game playable. The big yellow exclamation points and question marks in WoW are a distinct reminder that you're in a regular MMOrpg, lack of capitalization on the last three letters intentional. Something more subtle, like my or Verden's suggestion or what's shown in the mockup screenshots of MirceaKitsune's, would make more sense for PlaneShift.

[LigH]

... perhaps an NPC calling out to you when you pass within a certain range? "Hey, [your character's name], did you get those [items] yet?" or "So, what did [other NPC] say?"

I like that idea.

[MirceaKitsune]

A reply I posted on the tracker, regarding how much easier this would make PS in my opinion:

I don't think it would be turning it into a brainless game. Imo it just helps those who can't remember who to visit, and makes questing easier in many situations. One would still need to read the dialogues and understand the quests I believe, and will always follow the dialogues to know who to go to. The symbols would just help guiding players in case they get lost, and wouldn't be able to tell them who to visit over a distance. They can also be smaller and more discrete than my icons though, and should only show up from up close (optimally just a bit further than the floating names I think).

I find this useful for the situation I'm currently in (which I'm sure is pretty common). I have many quests on my list, and can't complete most because I don't know who to visit any more. If these symbols existed, I'd see the NPC's I need to visit while roaming around the towns, helping me finish many forgotten quests I can't otherwise (keeping me from getting any new quests to not crowd my list even further). I think it's better than being unable to continue at all imo. Not everyone has the memory for all NPC names and locations, which is why I find it very hard without this.

[Aiwendil]

You could still look up in the chat logs what the NPCs told you to do for the quests...no need for a good memory there. And for finding NPCs....how about asking other players?

If you logged out or crashed and you lost all previous dialog in your NPC tab you can still check your logs to find that information. You will find the logs folder following this path:

Windows: In the user home directory, usually in "Document and Setting\Username\Application Data\PlaneShift (make sure windows isn't hiding folders or enter %AppData% in the address bar of the explorer window)
Linux: ~/.PlaneShift
Mac OS X: ~User/Library/Application Support/PlaneShift (start at the house icon in the left bar of your finder window)

It is important to know where your logs are so you can review dialogs with NPCs and friends for quests and RP. Most problems in the tutorial arise from simply not reading what the NPCs say.