Improving the Quest System

[tman]

As a relatively new player who enjoys questing, I have a few suggestions that I think will help make questing more enjoyable and easier for new players.

The problem right now is that as a new player, you don't know where everything and everyone is.  So you talk to a few NPCs and get a few quests.  Not so bad.  However, you aren't sure where to go to do these quests, so you start talking to more NPCs hoping to find one you're supposed to talk to.  This just leads to getting more quests, for which you have to find more NPCs, and the spiral continues.

Eventually you find your quest log cluttered with dozens of quests, most of which you can't remember anything about.  So "questing" for the most part just turns into talking to every NPC you can find and seeing if they have any quest info for you.  To make matters worse, some of the quests involve things like killing tefusangs or making gold ingots, which are way out of reach for new players.  So I have a few suggestions for reducing the clutter and confusion of questing.

1. Distinguish between "Quests" and "Tasks"

Quests should be moderately long and story oriented, and as being story-oriented they should only be able to be completed once.  Tasks, on the other hand, are simple things that require little or no skill and can be done over and over (for example, Harnquist is Hungry, Jayose Lamp Fuel, Paper for Charisa, etc.).  Quests and tasks can have separate tabs in the quest journal to help reduce clutter.  Also, quests should have significantly higher rewards than tasks.

2. Reputation Point System

Another thing that would help reduce the overwhelming amount of quests new players face is to introduce a "reputation score" to the quest system.  Each quest or task should have a reputation requirement based on its difficulty.  Easy quests like learning leatherworking or the "tasks" mentioned above would have a requirement of 0 (anyone can do them) but harder quests that involve things like killing tefusangs, making gold ingots, or traveling to multiple cities would have a higher reputation requirement (new players wouldn't be able to do these anyway).  After all, you wouldn't hire someone you've never heard of to kill a tefusang and bring back its hide or carry your important delivery to the bronze doors.  You probably would ask them to bring you a couple apples or collect some rat eyes.  For each quest the player does, the reputation score would increase.  Quests or tasks that can be done multiple times would only give you reputation points the first time.

I think that these changes would help new players get accustomed to the game more easily and not feel overwhelmed by the amount of quests they have assigned to them, some of which they are not even able to do yet.

[Pakarro]

Just a few thoughts on that.

a) if you have too many quests already, do not take new ones.
b) use the notes in the quest log, to keep order
c) if in doubt, choose less elegant methods involving your own chat log...
d) Don't attempt to make stuff more complicated, as your problems can be solved using a) to c)

[LigH]

About 1.:

I believe something loosely related is being made as "quest chains". But making them with obvious enough relations is a challenge...

[Chessire]

I think one needs to remember that not all quests are for every character. So if you play someone that is not a smith its only reasonable they wouldn't take on a quest that involves smithing, or maybe they would to the point they can accomplish it (most quests give you the opportunity to stop helping the npc at every step). Most clearly, a kind hearted character would never do the Black Flame chain or Ukabnu's quests. Of course some quests need to be done, as Ukabnu's chain since its the only way to obtain the sleep glyph which is necessary to all mages. But I prefer to see that as something missing from the game right now and perhaps its a matter worthy of a whole new thread, young mages know nothing about how to regenerate their mana (without paying for mana potions) and later on only the evil-aligned Ukabnu's chain can offer the way out.

Back to the point, its true some npcs that give quests talk about other npcs as if they where their close friends and as if the player also knows them well. "Go to Charissa and bring me this and that." You don't talk like that to a stanger you just employed for a quick job, they should provide information about where Charissa is when asked. Or at least something like "She is an alchemist, you can find her at her home, in Hydlaa." That would save a new player looking all the way to Ojaveda, Gugrontid and Bronze Doors.

[Pakarro]

... Most clearly, a kind hearted character would never do .... Of course some quests need to be done, as ...

This is a really sore point. Doing the  quest chain (spoiler?) for sleep is a really impossible for my char. So I have to suffer and buy potions.... (
(I think the solution of sending off a bad twin is similarly revolting...)

Also, why I have to kill consumers to please Jardet remains a huge question mark...

What I really would appreciate in the quest chain is a number of ic possibilities to improve a "nice", tree and animal hugging Xiosia following character. 

[novacadian]

What I really would appreciate in the quest chain is a number of ic possibilities to improve a "nice", tree and animal hugging Xiosia following character.

Agreed, multiple solution approaches to quests are much more complimentary to those that care about the overall rp development of their characters. 

- Nova

[tman]

Just a few thoughts on that.

a) if you have too many quests already, do not take new ones.
b) use the notes in the quest log, to keep order
c) if in doubt, choose less elegant methods involving your own chat log...
d) Don't attempt to make stuff more complicated, as your problems can be solved using a) to c)

If you use the same character on different computers then you can't rely on quest notes and chat logs.  I use them when I can but it can still be frustrating.

As to your first point, as a new player with no skills and few options for making money and pps for training, quests are really the only way to go.  And once questing devolves into talking to every single NPC you find hoping they're the right one, you'll find that accepting as many quests as you can is the most effective way to go, since the more quests you have the higher the chances are that you'll run into one of the "right" NPCs.

As to the argument that you shouldn't accept many quests because you should always play in character, that's a valid point. Except that the vast majority of quests are "Hey can you fetch this item for me?"  So pretty much your character would either not do any of them, or he/she/kra would do all of them, since they're all pretty much the same.

As for the reputation idea, it doesn't really matter to me.  I just get annoyed when a quest seems like it's something my character should be able to do, and then midway through I realize it's far out of my reach.  For example, I was a new player when the cook in Brado's bar asked me to bring some rat hides.  Easy enough.  Then he asked for a tefusang tooth.  So that quest sat idle in my quest log until I gained another 30 or so sword and armor levels.

As for my other idea, I just think there's some intrinsic value in distinguishing between story-based one-time quests and repeatable busy-work tasks.  But that's just me.  If no one else feels this way that's fine.

[novacadian]

For example, I was a new player when the cook in Brado's bar asked me to bring some rat hides.  Easy enough.  Then he asked for a tefusang tooth.  So that quest sat idle in my quest log until I gained another 30 or so sword and armor levels.

My character was standing by the river not so long ago, talking with an old friend, when a new citizen came up to us and asked if we knew where he might find a tefusang tooth. Venorel rummaged in her pocket and produced three, offering them to him. He gladly excepted one and waved happily as he headed east towards Ojaveda. 

- Nova

[bilbous]

Players are often willing to help people who ask for it. I hung on to the shield bands quest for weeks before finally breaking down and asking someone to make them for me. Of course back then it was a lot harder to get to the appropriate shield making level.

[Mordaan]

We do have a reputation points system.  It's called factions.  Not every quest belongs to a chain and therefore has faction points given, but we really need to reorganize the quests and chains and make them better.  With well over 300 quests now, that is a big project.  For many of these quests, it is not clear what chain they should belong to, or they might be appropriate for more than one category.  It's something that will continue to be worked on.

[tman]

I like the factions thing.  The main problem with it right now in my opinion is that you can continue to get faction points for doing the same quest over and over.

Also I think there should be a better distinction between whether you're part of a faction or just an outsider helping out the faction.  I still don't know if my character is a guard or just a citizen helping them out.  Also I think having a good relationship with a faction should have some benefits.  For example, a 1% discount on training for every 10 or 20 faction points you have with the trainer's faction (up to a maximum discount of say 20%).

But all of this is a little  sorry

[novacadian]

Also I think there should be a better distinction between whether you're part of a faction or just an outsider helping out the faction. 

The faction points represent how well your relationship is with the faction. When doing many of the guard quests my character was rped to be a member of the sunshine squadron during that period; while having a badge (quest object) from the squadron during that period. So you could rp being part of the faction or just liked or disliked by them. You can get negative faction points by not being nice to a certain faction if memory serves.

- Nova