Hydlaa Trading Post

[Zalya]

It isn't really the power fantasy fiends that I have issue with, it's usually the every day roleplayer. As you mention further on, characters tend to be close to a player's heart, and whether they know it or not, they will often godmod in a seemingly subtle way to protect them. It wasn't long ago I tried to play a thief character. That didn't go so well, when it came to trying to pick someone's pocket (even for things non-existant, just for RP's sake), he would get caught every single time. He was publicly accused of thievery in hydlaa plaza. People complimented on his character in /tells, but I myself had a rotten time playing him.

I've always found the easiest way to fix that problem is to /tell a player and ask them if they'd like to be pick-pocketed OOCly. That seemingly insignificant piece of curtsey goes a long way. While it is true that sometimes people unconsciously protect their characters, that quick question often allows them to let their guard down a little for the sake of RP. And even after you get caught and publicly branded a thief it opens up a whole new set of ideas to RP with. Forgive the musical reference, but Jean Valjean from Les Misarables  is a good inspiration for a thief with a heart of gold. Opening that level of sympathy with others might make things a little more interesting. Of course I might not fully understand the situation, but the concept of a small amount of OOC coordination goes a long way in making things run smoothly for all players.

I fully understand. But for instances like that I have to say that the current player base is not quite at a point where it can handle more complex characters

Hah, you obviously haven't met me or really any of the people I hang around with. Course I'm only on about every other day and the others about every day.

Main point aside, flat characters are never interesting enough to hold most new people's attentions long enough to get them inescapably twisted into PS. If they just keep running into people with a single aspect to them (IE: A merchant who will only ever buy and sell things to/from you, with 0 ability to interact outside those parameters.) they will get bored and leave. Heck I lucked out my first day playing by spying on some crazy half-interrogation thing and getting caught then cornered as I had no idea how to navigate hydlaa.

There are actually a lot of really good characters out there. I also think part of the problem is that there isn't enough conflict going on to really reveal the other sides of characters. While it may seem like some chars are boring, I'm willing to bet they just haven't had the chance to evolve and progress through RP. I'm not really talking about violent conflict, but more of conflict of opinion. I've had some pretty fun RP's with Teshia over the usefulness of the guards.

Any ways on an on topic note, I would love to see this market idea take off. I think it would be awesome. But I am a little skeptical on how it will work if there is no real hook to it. Perhaps its just me but I'm a little afraid of this market appearing and then people appearing, and not knowing what to do. There is only so much you can do with a buy/sell RP. That gets boring kind of fast. There really needs to be some form of conflict, perhaps with gangs shaking down merchants for the space they use, or even something as simple as two competing kiosks. You know I'm behind you 100% Illy but I am curios to see how the idea of conflict in this new space will be worked in.

[Illysia]

There are actually a lot of really good characters out there. I also think part of the problem is that there isn't enough conflict going on to really reveal the other sides of characters. While it may seem like some chars are boring, I'm willing to bet they just haven't had the chance to evolve and progress through RP. I'm not really talking about violent conflict, but more of conflict of opinion.
...
Perhaps its just me but I'm a little afraid of this market appearing and then people appearing, and not knowing what to do. There is only so much you can do with a buy/sell RP. That gets boring kind of fast. There really needs to be some form of conflict
...

You're absolutely right on several points. But I suppose I should have anticipated the "what to do now?" part that might worry people. In the past, feeding people ideas that much used to illicit much whining and complaining from players that already knew full well what they were going to do, so I deliberately avoided that. Maybe it will help now if I list some issues that people can create or look for opportunities to get into.



Basically, whenever you get into an RP never forget to either take time to develop and explore your character or to take time to explore the characters around you. The market is just to get people in one place RPing with each other. Don't let the RP begin and end with "give me x of that item."

• You can take the time to look for a character to apprentice your character to or look for a character to take on as an apprentice
• Look for a character to make conversation with, find out who they are, where they are from, what they do(you never know when that info will be useful later
• If you are a thief, look for marks
• If you are a con artist, look for people to scam
• If you are a prima donna, look for an excuse to cause a scene or spectacle
• If you are in a complicated relationship, look for an opportunity to out the other person in public
• If you really can't stand someone, take a swing at them... (no weapons or magic within Hydlaa but it might be fair game in Oja and Gug)
• If you think that other character over there is attractive, try to approach them
• If the merchant is charging too much, haggle
• If haggling isn't working, make a scene and storm off to go find someone else to buy from and tell everyone you know they are a cheat
• If your character is nervous in crowds, explore how your character would react to having to be forced into crowds
• If you are looking to start another RP, start recruiting other players you pass
• If someone is lost, offer to show them around(RP it, don't just run them there then say bye OOCly)
• If you are a bard/storyteller/musician look for a new audience
• if you are a potter, brewer, jewelry maker, tailor, or any other unimplemented skill, start RPing your trade and look for business. The settings is not likely to drastically affect pots and shirt and metal rings.
• If you are a perfectly normal plain character, marvel at all the people with sad histories, dead relatives, extraordinary feats and aquaintences.
• If you are an orator, give speeches on the need to pressure the octarchy into a revision of the laws (and take consequences that may arise with that)
• so on and so forth...

Also, it would help to start giving your character more dimensions like Phantomboy86 mentioned. A while ago I created a list for players to use so they could look for aspects of their character that they haven't explored or that they need to work on. I'll put it here to for people that can make use of it.

Character Context Check

Use this checklist to look for places where your character would be unable do more than just stand there. When you find a place, work on a response that would be unique to your character or at the very least would reflect the character's personality or motivations. Admittedly, some of these situations may never happen in RP but they might be referenced, so it is a good idea to think about them just the same. Obviously, this is not a comprehensive list but it does cover a lot of things

How does your character react...

(Il)Legalities:
[  ] When being robbed
[  ] When being asked to participate in illegal activities
[  ] When being asked by the guards to assist in an investigation
[  ] When actually doing something illegal (willing/unwilling/aware of wrongness/not aware)
[  ] When being caught (by civilian/by guard)
[  ] When cornered by a vigilante mob
[  ] When cornered by a thug mob
[  ] When knowingly trespassing in various places (seedy places/official places/privately owned places)
[  ] When standing trial in the courthouse
[  ] When forced to choose between saving someone dear to the character or following the law
[  ] When a friend is arrested (wrongly arrested/justifiably arrested)
[  ] When a child does something illegal

In and Around Town:
[  ] When they find themselves in a library or place of learning
[  ] When they find themselves in a temple or place of worship
[  ] When they find themselves in a legal building
[  ] When they find themselves in a social gathering spot
[  ] When they find themselves in a quiet place
[  ] When they find themselves in a field or in nature
[  ] When they find themselves alone
[  ] When they find themselves in a market or place of business
[  ] When they find themselves in a hospital(like place) or place of healing
[  ] When they find themselves in an arena or place of combat
[  ] When they find themselves in a secret place
[  ] When they find themselves in a large city
[  ] When they find themselves in a small town
[  ] When they find themselves in a place with mostly one race (opposite of their own/ same as their own)
[  ] When they find themselves in a place with many races
[  ] When they find themselves in a place where they are easily ignored
[  ] When they find themselves in a place where they are noticed by everyone (positive attention/negative attention)

Character to Character Interactions
[  ] When your character meets a former friend or enemy
[  ] When your character meets a former or current lover
[  ] When your character meets a passing acquaintance
[  ] When your character meets a person of unclear relationship status (are you or aren't you on good terms)
[  ] When your character meets somone that tried to kill them
[  ] When your character meets somone that they are attracted too
[  ] When your character meets somone that they are repulsed by
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be very honest(ICly)
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be very dishonest(ICly)
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be a criminal(ICly)
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be connected with the legal system(ICly)
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be a vigilante
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be a victim
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be a merchant
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be a craftsmen
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be a vagrant
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be a drunk
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be high strung
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be very relaxed
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be "weird"
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to be from another part of Yliakum
[  ] When your character meets somone that is known to talk about OOC things ICly
[  ] When your character meets somone that claims to be very powerful (fighter/mage/misc)
[  ] When your character meets somone that claims to be very rich
[  ] When your character meets somone that claims to be from outside of Yliakum

Character Expression
note: A situation may call for a certain response but that doesn't mean that your character has to follow the script

[  ] When your character is expected to be sad at someone's death
[  ] When your character is expected to be happy about an event in another character's life
[  ] When your character is expected to disapprove of illegal or dark matters
[  ] When your character is expected to approves of legal matters or moral
[  ] When your character is expected to take the lead
[  ] When your character is expected to follow willingly
[  ] When your character is expected to back off
[  ] When your character is expected to do something that the character can't actually do
[  ] When your character is expected to do a favor
[  ] When your character is expected to drop everything
[  ] When your character is expected to be surprised
[  ] When your character is expected to be shocked
[  ] When your character is expected to be gentle
[  ] When your character is expected to be understanding
[  ] When your character is expected to be tender
[  ] When your character is expected to be affectionate
[  ] When your character is expected to be stern
[  ] When your character is expected to be mean
[  ] When your character is expected to be dishonest
[  ] When your character is expected to be honest
[  ] When your character is expected to be thoughtful
[  ] When your character is expected to leap without looking
[  ] When your character is expected to be dumb
[  ] When your character is expected to be intelligent
[  ] When your character is expected to be happy
[  ] When your character is expected to conform

[LigH]

+1 for moving Willam and adding MOTDs.

[Illysia]

Ok, I asked Venalan about whether making some of those earlier mentioned changes to the area were possible and it is. But it would only happen if there is more support. So if you really want storage over there then now would be the time to speak up.


For those who may not like the idea of trading but aren't necessarily against East Hydlaa. There are other things you can do with the kiosks.

• Have a wine tasting
• Set up an Open bar and just RP pouring drinks
• Do a puppet show
• Create your own mini museum exhibit
• Set up a kissing booth
• Set up a hugging booth
• Set up a free advice stand
• Set up an informal court for settling disputes between characters
• Set up a gem/jewelry appraising stand
• Set up a little clinic
• set up an arm wrestling tournament
• etc. ...

[MishkaL1138]

* Mishka raises a glass full of red wine, stares at it with a slight frown, smells it, takes a sip, thinks for a while, and after deliberating profoundly, speaks "I do think this is a red wine." *

[BoevenF]

Set up a free advice stand

Dr. Forita? I have a problem...
 

[LigH]

* LigH sets up a bachelor booth.

[Venalan]

So, I've read most of what has been said. I'd be happy to help set up some sort of recognized venue to give the players some where to go where you /know/ the people there will be there to proactively RP about [insert topic here] with any and all that turn up or as a place you can trade odd items or IC favours.

Now the one hesitation I have is that proposals and plans like these pop up from time to time but never get maintained by the players. If we the devs spend time setting up npcs and items and storage and MOTD/Tips and KAs and then load it to the server just to find you lot never use the area as the few people spearheading it have left and the drive vanishes it would be a complete waste. Ideally I'd like to see that people are at least trying to get something going in the area be it merchants or palm readers or people open to IC questions (Knowledge seekers) or guides or poets or Rivnak groomers or anything. Who then let me know about it.

But the only way for that area (or any area) to be an area people look to to find something to do is if you guys as players sit there with a character(s) and wait and RP when people come up. Hopefully with some effort and time this would lead to more hanging out and more coming by and a reputation for the place building up.

[Illysia]

But the only way for that area (or any area) to be an area people look to to find something to do is if you guys as players sit there with a character(s) and wait and RP when people come up. Hopefully with some effort and time this would lead to more hanging out and more coming by and a reputation for the place building up.

I'm willing to start the effort of making pushes for this, but I need support if it's going to stick.

[Candy]

Set up a free advice stand

I'm off of PS for a bit due to real life complications, but when I get back I am so having my wannabe-psychologist stick a "The doctor is IN, 5 trias" sign on one of those kiosks and wait for the business to roll in...

[Zalya]

Basically, whenever you get into an RP never forget to either take time to develop and explore your character or to take time to explore the characters around you. The market is just to get people in one place RPing with each other. Don't let the RP begin and end with "give me x of that item."

Interesting. I like it. I really think this can work. I won't be online much at all until Friday, but I hope to see people there! Maybe I'll even set up a stand if I am feeling adventurous.

[Illysia]

I'll be periodically trying to get stuff started there, so you can look for me online and poke me about it. I'm sure we'll cross paths eventually.

[cdmoreland]

Some of the recent changes have made it too hard to level anything for a new player. Removing rats from the arena, too few rats and poisonings by diseased rats and others in the sewers has left only Ojaveda to train low levels of weapons and armor and the trainers are in Hydlaa.

My real question is, are the devs against grinding for character development?

Ok, I am not a great role player, but I do my best. My pet-peeve is those that don't do any work to develop skills but rp that they can kick Waesed's butt. I have been accused of god-modding when I have the skills. 

The market area in East Hydlaa is a great idea and a Storage NPC would be a real help.

People need to cut the new players some slack when it comes to ooc in Main chat. They will learn if you don't run them off first. You can build the player base by helping and being gentle with correction. If your character wouldn't do that, direct them to someone that will like Jemima, Waesed, and many others (don't be offended if I didn't mention someone, I am bad remembering names).

I have thought about quitting because of the changes, but I do love this game.

Let's rp like it is real, be real, and let others know who you want them to think you are. chit-chat is one of my favorite things to do, hanging around and having a few reds with anyone.

I have found that you can write in a book what you want to trade if it isn't in the game yet. That gives someone the ability to trade it themselves after they receive it.

[Bonifarzia]

Some of the recent changes have made it too hard to level anything for a new player. Removing rats from the arena [...]

Maybe I am off topic here, but I think the changes to the spawning points in the arena have made things easier for new players, as the grouping of creatures according to their strength should be more clear now and there are plenty of rats in one single spot. The main problem is when players lure the ratties away and then forget to clean up the mess (i.e. to kill lost rats such that they respawn in the proper place).

On topic: I support the idea, it would be welcome to have more trading (RP) activity in the neighborhood.

[Illysia]

On the grinding versus straight RP thing. One form is as valid as the other since some RPers would be upset at always being at a disadvantage because they can't play long hours to grind to their characters to the proper level. The real issue is players treating RPing like a single player game that is to be "beaten."

I would suggest using the same methods as players who RP relationships between characters. Don't enter into that kind of RP with someone you don't already have some sort of understanding with. Making sure that you and the other player are on the same page before you go farther will help cut down greatly on causes for aggravation.