Author Topic: Game Creation  (Read 3376 times)

Fanomatic2000

  • Hydlaa Notable
  • *
  • Posts: 615
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #15 on: October 31, 2003, 07:03:45 am »
Who said you must buy it? Hehe! :rolleyes:


Be a member of our Mirthful community.
Join us today!   :]

Note:  This is my old account. I am now known as \"Jadd\".

Niber

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 290
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #16 on: October 31, 2003, 03:13:17 pm »
My tip on making games is to start make a game of your own but use simple tools like Flash (here\'s a link to one of my first Flash game: http://www.niber.net/download/kp.exe ) but not too simple like Klick n\' Play. The good thing about Flash is that the grafics and programming is intregraded so good + the programing is similar to C++ so you will learn that.

And then when you feel like you are ready to use proffesional tools like 3dsmax\\Maya (for grafix), MS Visual C++ .NET\\Borland C++ (for programing) and Cubase SX (for music production) then specialize in one of them instead of trying to master them all. It is possible to be good at them all, but it is nearly impossible to make a good game by yourself with these tools.

But that is my way there is other ways like making mods and stuff.
Put the pot down, no dont take another puff!, put it down. Thank you.

Wedge

  • Hydlaa Notable
  • *
  • Posts: 619
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2003, 08:10:50 am »
Flash is good for starting 2-D game development.  I used Project Fun for a couple years.  It\'s limited, but gives you a good idea of game structure and logic and is VERY easy to use.

Right now I\'m working with Wild Tangent, a DirectX based API that is simple for 3-D games, you can even program them in JavaScript!
Ninjas have feelings too.  Mostly they feel like dancing.



Zeonire

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 64
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2003, 03:38:24 pm »
IN my 2 years of programming practice, I have mastered how to use Java, C++, and Visual Basix... Now me and my friends gave up the idea for about a year, but plan on \"rebooting\" the game creation later on. Lol, most of us are 15 w/o jobs outside of mowing lawns.

But anyways, yeha, I know about the expenses, but I didn\'t think it\'d be THAT much. I already got Java on my PC and plan on purchasing C++ w/ some of the money I got saved up.

I am building the \"COming Soon\" site. The game\'s name is \"Legends of Handris.\" Handris being the world...

Thanx for the advice, everyone!

-Zeonire.
The Matrix Has You...

PROUD LORD OF THE MAGES/HEALERS SECTION OF THE CIRCLE OF LEGENDS.

Kiva

  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 1366
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2003, 04:55:41 am »
If you\'ve mastered C++, how come you\'re saying you want to buy it? Unless I\'m entirely mistaken, my little C++ experience tells me that all you need is a Linux OS, a Text editor, and some basic Linux programs, that come included in the full install ( such as \"CP\" :P )... What\'s there to buy? Linux is free.
\"Somewhere over the rainbow...\"

Dameon

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 361
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #20 on: November 02, 2003, 05:05:39 am »
Well Grom, if you use windows like me, you will need a C++ editor and compiler. I got a pirated version of Visual C++ on Kazaa, but there are other free ones around.

acraig

  • Administrator
  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 1562
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #21 on: November 02, 2003, 05:46:26 am »
Quote
Originally posted by Zeonire
IN my 2 years of programming practice, I have mastered how to use Java, C++, and Visual Basix...


Will in my roughly 10 years of experiance I would only count myself \'comfortable\' with my knowledge of C++ and Java.   You will find that as you get older there is less and less you know until it becomes a crushing weight on your shoulders with exactly how little you do know.  :)

Quote

But anyways, yeha, I know about the expenses, but I didn\'t think it\'d be THAT much. I already got Java on my PC and plan on purchasing C++ w/ some of the money I got saved up.


There are some free compilers available for the windows platform.  I would really suggest spending the bucks ( maybe up to $100 ) on a boxed version of a C++ compiler. ( For java it is really easy to find good IDE\'s on the web ).

Programming is a profession just like any others and it takes time, training and a certain level of skills.   If you have a  scalpel  and some tissues does that make you a neurosurgeon?
----------
Andrew
"For all I know, she's lying, everyone's lying; welcome to the Internet"

Darkmoon

  • Developers
  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 95
  • "----------"
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #22 on: November 02, 2003, 05:58:44 am »
Online stores for Discreet and Alias|Wavefront have the following prices:

3D Studio Max 6: $3495.00

Maya 5 Complete: $1999.00
Maya 5 Unlimited: $6,999.00

Also, Caligari Truspace 6.6 is listed at $595.00.  They have full version 3.2 avaliable as a free download, I think.

Evanchild

  • Hydlaa Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 441
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #23 on: November 02, 2003, 06:32:50 am »
you can get maya personal free but it cannot render anyhting without plastering student edition all over it.
teenmethod
Freelancing.  Looking for a home.

Zeonire

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 64
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #24 on: November 02, 2003, 07:03:24 am »
I\'d reiterate what Dameon said, but it would only look I\'m copying what he said, so I\'m not gonna, but I happen to be on windows...thats all ive ever been on. BUt anyways, I\'m pretty dang sure that there is no way that, for free, i can make the graphics for the game a bit less quality than PS, but definitely a hell of a lot better than RS\'s.

And to what acraig said, i agree- it does take time. The onyl reason I have gotten good at it so quickly is because I have taken 5 programming courses in 2 years: BST, Web Design, Page Design, Programming, and Programming II...

And, as a final statement, Legends of Handris, the game I was starting, is put off for another year, or at most a year...I need a job and so does the rest of my team...we need a heck of a lot more than we thought...
The Matrix Has You...

PROUD LORD OF THE MAGES/HEALERS SECTION OF THE CIRCLE OF LEGENDS.

Kiva

  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 1366
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #25 on: November 02, 2003, 07:49:37 am »
Well, we could call that \"Mistake #1\". :)
\"Somewhere over the rainbow...\"

Cha0s

  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 1860
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #26 on: November 02, 2003, 04:31:28 pm »
Free 3d software:

Wings3d: http://www.wings3d.com/
Blender: http://www.blender3d.com/

Voila, free, no charge. Only issue: very difficult to understand how to use... But hey, if you don\'t put any time in you won\'t get anywhere in the first place.

Good luck!
Cha0s
Mac OS X Forum Moderator
In-Game Roleplay Forum Moderator
Please search and skim existing threads before posting!

RonHiler

  • Traveller
  • *
  • Posts: 49
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #27 on: November 02, 2003, 07:11:32 pm »
Ah, building a game on a limited budget.  Something I know a bit about :)  Here is my $0.02

Allow me to add Milkshape3D to the list of modelers.  It\'s not free (about $30 to register it IIRC), but it\'s the best 3D modeler I\'ve seen that isn\'t outragously priced.  It\'s very 3DSMax-like, without the price tag.  Also it supports about a zillion file formats.  I highly recommend it.  It\'s what we\'re using for Sovereignty.  It\'ll do the usual 3D modelling stuff, allow you to set texture coords (although to be honest, I\'m not thrilled with the way they handle this, but it works), set bone structure and handle animation.  Its a pretty impressive package, IMO.

For a paint program, the only choice is Paint Shop Pro.  Also pretty cheap, about $100 IIRC.  I don\'t think there is any other option :)

For C++ compiler, I agree with Andrew, you get what you pay for.  GCC is workable, but I wouldn\'t want to use it :)  MSVC++ is the industry standard, but I also would urge you to look into Borland\'s line of compilers (Builder), they are very good.  You won\'t want to use the VCL or MFC for your game proper (too slow, their not designed for fast paced games), but for tools (like terrain editors or database management programs), those libraries are invaluable, and my feeling is that the VCL (Borland) is far superior to the MFC (MS).  Just my opinion.  Either way, this will be your big expense, the compilers aren\'t cheap (about $500 for the professional versions for either one).  But this is definately where you should invest your money, a good compiler is *essential*.

As for a 3D engine, you can buy one (or use a free one), or roll your own.  For Sov, we did the latter.  PS did the former.  The advantage to rolling your own is that you will be able to modify it to work best with your game without any problems, rather than wait on the desingers of the engine to work with you.  The disadvantage is that you just added a year\'s worth of work to your project :)   Take your pick, it\'s a personal choice.  If you get a pre-existing one, Crystal Space seems to be about the best (that I know of anyway, I\'m not an expert in this area).

If you need a database, use MySQL.  No reason to use anything else.  The only drawback is that MySQL is under the GPL license, which means that (unless you want to open source your game or pay the licensing fee) you can only use it for the server, not for the clients.  But that\'s probably okay, you don\'t want to have a database system on the client end anyway, database work should strictly be on the server end.

As for knowledge:

Know C++ *well* (or Java, if you are going that way).  This is a absolute prerequesite.  As Andrew said, the more you learn about C++, the more you will realize you don\'t know :)  If you know classes and inheritance and operating overloading, and understand the concepts of object oriented programming, you\'ll probably do okay.

For networking, know sockets.  WinSock if you are intending a windows platform, BSD sockets if not (pretty much the same thing anyway).  If you are talking about a MMOG, you probably want UDP packets with an IOCP model for the server.  The clients can use a simpler model (we use asynchronous socket model for the Sov clients).

Know DirectX, if you are doing Windows.  Especially Direct3D, DirectSound, and DirectInput.  There is also DirectPlay, which has mixed reviews.  I prefer Sockets over DPlay, but that\'s up to you.  The jury is stilll out on whether DPlay can handle MMOG levels of players.

For the database access, you will need to know the MySQL language.  It\'s not too hard to pick up though.

That should get you started, I think.  None of these is a real prerequesite except the knowledge of the language you are using.  For instance, when we started Sov, I knew JACK about Winsock, and within a couple of months, studies up enough to put together an IOCP server (the most complex but powerful type).  If you know *nothing* about 3D programming and are planning on building your own engine, that might be an updward climb, but it can be done.

Above all, break your game down into systems and implement them one at a time, using OOP techniques.  You can\'t finish the whole thing in a day or even a year probably.  Stick with it, be willing to learn and learn from your mistakes (you will makes lots, trust me, hehe), do lots of research, and be willing to ask when you don\'t know (you will sometimes make yourself look foolish, you should see some of my posts on gamedev, heh).

Wow, this became a much longer post than I intended.  I just meant to recommend Milkshape :)  Sorry \'bout that, LOL.

Good luck,

Ron

Zeonire

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 64
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #28 on: November 03, 2003, 03:17:29 pm »
Lol, yeah, that would be \"Mistake #1.\"

But anyways, the team has decided that we are putting it off for at least a little while...we don\'t want to have runescape graphics, because thsoe are simply pathetic as hell...

I know Jav and C++, you could get nowhere without. I have laready looked into MySQL and that is the database I am using.

And yeah, that was long, lol, but helpful :)

-Zeonire.
The Matrix Has You...

PROUD LORD OF THE MAGES/HEALERS SECTION OF THE CIRCLE OF LEGENDS.

Djaggernaut

  • Hydlaa Resident
  • *
  • Posts: 148
    • View Profile
(No subject)
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2003, 01:45:14 am »
If you want to do a game you have so much things to consider. Buying the software is probably what takes the less time.
You can even start with an illegal version and buy it later. (why not...)
You need to define a good gameplay based on a precise concept.
Planeshift concept is now a bit classic because the game takes lot of time to do.
Depending of your game you\'ll need to find the good person. If you want correct graphics, you need 3D artist. It\'s not something you\'re going to learn in a year or two.

And remember completing a game is actually extremely hard.
I work in the game industry for Phelios Inc. We\'re doing 2D GAMES, and it\'s still really long and hard to do.
So imagine what could be a full 3D game.

I don\'t want to discourage you, but there are not so many way:
- you LOVE doing game, you know it\'s what you\'d always wanted to do or it\'s a good reconversion.
- you do that because it just looks cool.

Good luck with it, but think about gathering the good skills, checking if you\'re not too ambitious on your game, have a good concept (example: In Memoriam) and just love creating!


(BTW, you must aim to better graphist than PS! Do not restrict yourself!)
Djaggernaut  - http://www.tridinaut.com