Hello,

Time for some new input, methinks...
@Talad: You say, "Keep the ideas coming."

But in this thread you were only commenting on Damola's posts (which had plenty of interesting ideas), but you did not react to what Volki and I wrote.
I know you have issues with Volki, but this post was really good, maybe Volki's best post ever, and therefore deserves a reaction.

I like you guys trying to discuss and give your impression, I read your message but I think it still remains a bit generic. About Volki's post, it's mostly questions, and anyway I'm not taking very seriously feedback from people who didn't even try to experience in game the Dryken Plane.

About having a simplified version of the Dryken plane, I would rather have a more enjoyable one. A place where you have more things to see and do. What can we add? What lore pieces can we convey and how? Should there be more NPCs to talk to (in Stonelabyrinths as well)? What should they say?

About the drops in the SL, those are already there since last release. There are 6 one-way drops, making the navigation way simpler.

Uadjet:  Hello and welcome to the Developer's Q&A! This is an out-of-character meeting where you can hear about the development of the game and ask the Dev and GM teams any questions you might have. If you do have any questions, please line up at the lecterns in front of the stage.
Uadjet:  If there are no immediate questions, I'll give a quick recap.
Uadjet:  Talad's been working steadily on improving character models and textures.
Uadjet:  Well, more than that. He's working on rigging too.
Uadjet:  It's the same as rigging on a ship, really, which is why the same term is used.
Uadjet:  While ships use ropes and cables to control the movable parts of the ship, the rigging in 3D models is the 'bones' set up to control how a character moves.
Uadjet:  Talad has posted some of the improvements in Discord, if you're curious.
Anysu:  Saw enki head!
Uadjet:  Yeah, he's worked on the Enki textures too.
Anysu:  Saw the texuring on enki in stream of fur!
Thosor:  Yes, furry people can have a fuzzy naval now...
Uadjet:  We're slowly getting upgraded to fancier versions of what we currently are.
Anysu cheers for fur
Uadjet:  That includes adding robes, for the race/gender combos that don't currently have them.
Anysu:  Hopefully the Ylian female wlill get armor and robes.
Uadjet:  Yeah, that's the model that Talad purchased from... cgtrader? I don't recall exactly, and I can't find the link now.
Gonger:  But it would also be nice to see things fixed like twirling feet (after TP), or speech bubbles...
Uadjet:  Turbosquid. That's where it's from.
Anysu nods at Gonger
Anysu:  Nice to have actual Ylian female now.
Uadjet:  For the twirling feet, I did look into (aka google) that a while back. It could be that our skeletons lack a few of the bones that the IK was designed for. I'm not sure if tha's it, though, as that issue seems to cause feet to twist but not spin constantly.
Gonger looks down at his feet.
Uadjet:  And it seems inconsistent. Not everyone sees the same thing, which is baffling. We're all using the same client versions. Next time it happens, let's compare OS's.
Gonger:  My impression was that people see themselves differently than others see them.
Gonger:  Like, I never saw my feet spin, but others told me they did spin.
Anysu nods at Gonger
>Thosor nods at Gonger.
Uadjet:  Yes, that's what I've heard. There's also the legs trailing behind issue.
Uadjet:  That looks like an IK issue too, where the feet are having trouble finding the ground. But why do some clients see that and not others?
Thosor:  I've noticed NPC legs trailing, recently.
Gonger:  I even saw a long-legged NPC recently...
Gonger:  Multiple evidence
Anysu:  Yet only see it on players when we are tped.
Anysu:  At least what I have seen.
Gonger:  True, that.
Uadjet:  Yes. Let's get this written down. The more clues we have, the easier this will be to solve.
Gonger:  Imagine how this looks on a stream for the outside world...
Uadjet:  True.
Thosor:  now, NPCs teleport themselves at times. maybe then they get trailing legs?
Uadjet:  That's a thought.
Uadjet:  I wish /percept worked, as then I could teleport NPCs and force them to walk.
>Anysu nods at Thosor.
Uadjet:  I don't think I've seen it on non-playable races. They don't have the same skeletons, or the IK system.
Thosor:  I know I've seen it on Hydlaa guards.
Thosor:  And I think the gov't woman while they were walking.
Uadjet:  Okay, that's good to know.
Anysu:  Well if non-playable races do not have it..solution. We all need to be monster races!
Uadjet:  You first!
Thosor:  Monster shredder.
Anysu:  lol
Uadjet:  As for me, I'm trying to wrap up the set of quests I've written. I'm checking them for errors, and seriously regretting the complexity of some of them.
Anysu:  I knew it... minute I typed it
Uadjet:  Had to do it.
Anysu:  Kikiri in chain. Fear my talons and beak of death
Thosor whacks it with a kikiri-on-a-stick.
Anysu nips Thosor's finger
Thosor:  It is padded, not to hurt.
Anysu:  Chain color looks good though on kikiri
Anysu:  Monster curse day is months away
Thosor:  Staff is good for practice jousting...
Uadjet:  I do have dozens of items to plan out, but I've got most of the work done on that already. No new art needed.
Uadjet:  Oh, good. Found my item list in Notepad++. Was worried there for a minute.
Uadjet:  So the Observatory quests need a little work, some items, and two small map setups. Just a few items, and maybe a cow.
Uadjet:  Oh, and a couple criter spawns.
Uadjet:  I've also worked on a few other ideas that I'll run past Talad, like a merchant syndicate for Amdeneir that'll be an alternate path to Winch access.
Anysu:  Nice to have another path to Winch
Uadjet:  I got nothing done in the last week, unfortunately. The AC went out, and it sapped my ability to accomplish anything other than keeping people cool . It got up to 88?F/31?C in the house.
Gonger:  Yep... that's global warming for everybody...
Anysu:  Eeeekkk hot!
Gonger:  How does your mother handle this?
Uadjet:  Fortunately it was only a contactor that needed replacing, but for some reason I insisted on verifying that before ordering anything. As I couldn't work on live electronics ourdoors while it's raining or there's lightning nearby, that caused a bit of a delay.
Uadjet:  And then Amazon thinks that 'overnight delivery" means 48 hours...
Thosor:  Check the motor capacitors while your at it for prevention.
Uadjet:  She was okay. I set up an ice fan and a little mister to help her stay cool.
Thosor:  Amazon long ago dropped overnight, mainly overweek now...
Gonger:  I had a product delivery postponed... new provisional delivery date: May 15 - September 28
Uadjet:  Yeah, the capacitor is showing its age, but it's still working. I'm ordering a spare capacitor and another contactor to have handy if it fails again.
Uadjet:  They're cheap parts, fortunately.
Thosor:  back here, is there a way to make the interface setting time stamp button stick?
Uadjet:  Maybe $30 total for both.
Uadjet:  Yeah, that's one of the settings that doesn't stick around, like the interface settings.
Uadjet:  That's a client-side fix, I assume.
Thosor:  Anything that can be put in local config file?
Uadjet:  That's on the bugtracker, FS#7589.
Thosor:  oh, so it is listed, good.
Uadjet:  I don't see any config files for that, unfortunately.
Thosor:  ok, I think I won't log unless I set to timestamp.
Thosor:  I want timestamps always anyway...
Thosor:  I think my porg is about done...
Anysu:  Anymore news?
Uadjet:  No, I think that's it. Any questions?
Thosor:  No questions, Your Honor
Uadjet:  Then I think we can bring the meeting to a close.
Uadjet:  Thank you all for coming, and I'll see you all here again in two weeks!

Uadjet:  Hello and welcome to the Developer's Q&A! This is an out-of-character meeting where you can hear about the development of the game and ask the Dev and GM teams any questions you might have. If you do have any questions, please line up at the lecterns in front of the stage.
Anysu:  No idea what happened there
>Anysu greets everyone.
Anysu:  Was in plaza. tp plazza again. Relogged and was falling. But I heard whar was going on in main
Anysu:  Can you all see me?
Uadjet:  Okay, the first sounds like a tp failure due to collision, which would presumably have been the table.
Anysu:  Oh you tried to place me on table!
Uadjet:  Yeah
Anysu:  Awe dang it failed.
Anysu:  Thanks for effort
Uadjet:  I'll get the coordinates and use those.
Anysu:  Okay. Thanks for getting me here in end!
Gonger:  Did anybody read my latest post on the Dryken Plane? I still try to prevent the Plane from chasing away too many newbies...
Anysu:  Did not see it.  But thanks for trying.
Uadjet:  I have, yes.
Uadjet:  I think it's a godo idea to start with something else, but I think we need a concrete plan to propose to Talad.
Gonger:  I tried to outline such a plan, but better ideas are welcome.
Uadjet:  That's the most recent thread in Gameplay>>General Discussion
Gonger:  I just made a small but important modification to the first line of the post.
Gonger:  Well, the forums are not so overused that it should be hard to find...
Uadjet:  Yeah, the "recent posts" section on the main page of the forum is how I found it.
Uadjet:  The gist is that the current Dryken Plane is maybe not the best or most accurate first impression of the game.
Anysu nods
Gonger:  I disagree about the "maybe"...
Uadjet:  Heh, I was just trying to soften things a bit.
Uadjet:  Talad is fond of it, however, so does anyone have any thoughts on how to keep the Dryken Plane section, but with something more like regular gameplay before it?
Anysu:  Perhaps a line in all adverts with link to that Dryken plane. Line that mentions this is not (Or something like that) what game is like.
Anysu:  Dryken plane vid I meant
Gonger:  My idea is to have a small scenario BEFORE the Dryken Plane... so it would no longer be the first thing after character creation.
Uadjet:  My ideal solution would be a little map on each home world, but that would take a ton of effort and wouldn't make sense for Lemurs and Kran.
Uadjet:  Then again, there's no reason they'd been in the Dryken Plane.
Anysu:  Maybe a sceerio with the leaders or council etc from all that races telling the people of the portal and need to do through.
Anysu:  But as Uadjet of homeworld above, yeah be alot.
Anysu:  But yeah would not fit Lemur or Kran
Damola:  I love it how Damola can sit on thin air.
Damola:  It is the levitation glyph.
>Gonger greets Damola.
>Anysu waves at Damola
Damola:  Silent meditation time?
Anysu:  Neither does it fit a player who may want in backstory a character that was not born on homeworld.
Uadjet:  Just thinking about the Dryken Plane and ways to make it fit into the game a little more smoothly.
Anysu:  We talking abot the Plane
Gonger:  We discuss the Dryken Plane, I had some ideas in my latest forum post.
Anysu:  Anysu and ALL my characters  were born here.
Gova:  I think's it's assumed that new players were born on the homeworlds. As mentioned that doesnt' really fit with Kran, Lemur, and Ynnwn.
Gova:  Any of those coming in via the Dryken Plane makes no sense. It's like taking the interstate to get to a friend's place two doors down.
Damola:  Yeah.
Uadjet:  The current Dryken Plane could be done as a flashback, I suppose, or... I dunno. I just throught about a little outpost in the Dryken Plane, but I think that's beyond Yliakum's capabilities.
Uadjet:  Vodul is, I assume, the eyes that talk to you in there.
Anysu:  I could see a flashback scenerio
Damola:  Hmmm? I wonder what would be a natural way for a Kran to come to be? Gemmation? And what of a Lemur,or Ynnwn? Birth?
Damola:  Now? I am not sure whether new players would enjoy playing their char as a baby for an extended perioud of time first? so? of course a Kran could spawn directly in Gugontrid, assumung kra had their childhood there.
Gova:  It worked in Fallout 3... for a couple minutes.l
Damola:  Also of course a Nolthrir for example could also be born in Yliakum.
Gonger:  Damola, Ronasi, before you arrived I repeated that my main point is that the Dryken Plane is TERRIBLE as a first impression of PlaneShift, so I feel something should be done about this...
Damola:  Not necessarily every new Nolhrir would arrive from the home world? also in lore? consider? all those catastrophies, the acocalypses in the homeworlds happened a huge long time ago? why would still many new people leave their home world? If they did not back then, what would have been the chance to survive there even to the present day?
Damola:  The Dryken plane for me does not make all that much sense ICly, lore-wise.
Damola:  Just thinking about it.
Uadjet:  I think the idea is that the trip takes a variable amount of time. In most cases it's only a few years in which people can leave the dying words.
Damola:  And yes? Gonger, the Dryken plane, even in its simpler form may deter many new players from playing the game.
Damola:  Hmmm? but a trip through the portal taking one hundred or more cycles? Sounds like bending things into place to force them to fit into lore.
Damola:  So still does not make all that much sense to me the longer I think about it.
>Anysu nods at Damola.
Damola wonders whether there are any new Youtube videos, were people try to solve Dryken Plane and rant about it.
Damola:  Anyway, what have been some of your suggestions so far?
Damola:  Remove Dryken Plane and let players start directly in the tutorial area. May be one of the best options, but I am not sure Talad would be happy about it.
Anysu:  And what of rp? What if a new player having come through portal rps wth another: You recall that trip? Do you remeber home word? ANd those of us who may be in mindset ic that I do not recaall I was born here.
Damola:  But that option would give players the freedom to decide for themselves how they got here.
Anysu:  Continuity failure thete in rp.
Damola:  They spawn in tutorial area? and can make up their own story.
Damola:  Actually the story of Damola is that she has been born by her parents in the lower planes.
Damola:  Damola has not come from the home world.
Damola:  Their ancestors some generations before have.
Damola:  That is always how I understood lore.
Anysu:  Same with Anysu. Born on a world level.. think it was 2 or 3.
>Anysu nods at Damola.
Damola:  I am also not intending to change that. Damola has not been through Dryken Plane ICly. period.
Anysu nods at Damola
Damola:  What options did you discuss?
Damola ponders "The only thing about the Dryken Plane is teaching new players some of the history? I quite like the narrated story how Nolthrirs left their home world through the portal for example?"
Uadjet:  I mentioned making a little map for each homeworld, but there are both technical and lore problems with that.
Damola:  ? however? that intro can remain independently of the Dryken Plane. One does not need the Dryken Plane for that intro to work.
Gonger:  The idea I posted in the forums would probably not be too hard to make, but it is maybe not yet detailed enough...
Damola:  I really thought that little intro added something valuable, but it could have been the parents telling Damola about the history of her ancestors or she could have learned it in school? one does not need a Dryken Plane for that.
Damola:  Reading forum post? wait a moment.
Anysu:  I just mentioned in adverts, a notice and link to Plane video, that game is not all like this.
Damola:  Well feel free to continue to discuss? but I am still going to read that post now
Gonger:  What do you mean, Anysu? In adverts?
Uadjet:  Yeah, the race-specific bits are very nice.
Damola:  Hmmm, maybe this needs several iterations of discussion. Discuss it a bit, then let it sit and see what ideas come up and then continue to discuss it at another dev q&a or in forum.
Anysu:  or a vid of world leaders telling people to head to portal.
Anysu:  Advertisments
Anysu:  Where ever you mention game
Anysu:  Whatever media used,
Gonger:  Maybe you want to join the PR team... (me only, right now).
Damola:  I have one idea, reading your post Gonger? about this adversary having a nemesis?
Damola:  it is not very concrete indeed? however I think just a very good ideal came to my mind that one can use to think about and come up with a plan.
Anysu:  An idea, yet I do not have time to even play game during week. And I am no good at using the socials...Ihave none. But Discord.
Damola:  What if?
Damola:  ? Dryken Plane does not need to be the first thing that happens after character creation? but as you mentioned before there could be some flash back kind thing? and a way to hook this up could be a quest line where the char is either having visions or is told some of the the original happening how their ancestors or for Kran and Lemur and Ynnwn how *other* races came to Yliakum.
Damola:  ? that way you do not have to get rid of Dryken Plane, but it would be possible to embed it into some quest line.
Damola:  The only thing that may be hard about it? it may be challenging to implement? but on the other hand? it could be done in a similar way than Menita's puzzle.
Damola:  In a sense the Dryken Plane could be like a dungeon, like the Lava Cave or Menita's puzzle? and a quest line leads to it?
Damola:  But it would happen later in game for those that take on that quest line.
Damola:  The intro for the race can still be played after character creation. And there could be an intro for Kran as well, how Talad created them. Or is there already? And for Lemur and for Ynnwn.
Damola:  That way Talad gets to keep the Dryken Plane, it would not be necessary to completely remove it, but new players 1. create a char, 2. view the intro for their race, 3. spawn into tutorial area and enter the game much more easily.
Gonger:  Honestly, personally I had so many negative reactions from newbies on Discord and on Whispering them that at this point I want ANYTHING before the Dryken Plane, so newbies get a better first impression of PlaneShift.
Damola:  Well with my suggestion would completely remove the Dryken Plane out of new character comes into the world process.
Damola:  But it could be accessed later during a specific quest line like Menita's puzzle for example.
Damola:  And indeed, the more I think about it? it might be best to do away with Dryken Plane during new player experience.
Damola:  I often enough thought, after Talad made it simpler? it is not too bad? but apparently? it still demotivates too many new players.
Damola:  Anyway, we are way over the time. I am all for picking this up during next dev q&a again.
Gonger:  Yes. And it has literally nothing to do with the rest of PlaneShift...
Anysu:  This is good input, and could be worked on also in forums... YET it is not us that needs convincing, BUT Talad.
Damola:  Then all of us had two weeks to ponder about it and generate new ideas.
Damola:  Fair point, Anysu, fair point. I indeed have the feeling that Talad is quite in favor of the Dryken Plane.
Gonger:  He is... I remember how hard it was to convince him to improve the first version.
Damola:  But the better and more elaborated our ideas become, the easier may it be to convince him.
Gonger:  And that first version was unplayable...
Damola:  It was hard indeed. I had to use the short cut to run in order to make it in time.
Gonger:  Uadjet, still there?
Uadjet:  Yup
Damola:  Anyway, we are way over time.
Damola:  I think I just write down my thoughts in forum.
Anysu:  Do you have any udates you want to shortcut version give, Uadjet?
Damola:  Ahahaha, I thought you did the update part already? so you discussed Dryken Plane all the time?
Anysu:  On meeting topics
Uadjet:  Yeah. One quick thing: Talad has continued working on weapons and shields, and an item inspection tool where you can get a better look at the objects in game. You'll get the 3d item in front of you, where you can turn it about. Kinda like what was in Skyrim.
Anysu:  Yup Damola
Anysu:  Cool idea of having such a tool
Damola:  Would love to read a quick update thingy before concluding this.
Uadjet:  Okay, so let's break here, and then in two weeks we can continue the conversation. I may do the update first.
Damola:  Haha, okay!
Damola:  Thanks for updating me on the conversation. I knew I was a bit late to it.
Damola:  Unreal-Damola already has 2,7 MiB chat log already?
Damola:  ? will nicely add up over the years.
>Damola waves at Bookstand
Damola:  See you, Bookstand? and everyone else!
Damola:  Thanks for the meeting.
Ronasi's bookstand tries to wave back but fails
Damola chuckles brightly as she leaves.
>Ronasi waves at Damola
Gonger:  Do not forget to leave the building before Quitting.

Thanks Talad for the suggestion, I'm now on discord searching for my old guild mates, Love the way Planeshift is going and I'm sure we'll see some growth on it as well,, on that note I'm planning on being on more often, I noticed that I still have a guild bank, so I'm resurrecting the domain, not sure if I'll be lucky enough to find any of the old pages out there as the domain had lapsed and i just bought it back from scratch, any ways Thanks for all the hard work you've done, and let's play on.