Will there be Idiot Control in PS?

[beachbum0369]

to go along with the quotes before i have a nice one \" stupid is as stupid does\"

[Pegasus]

Originally posted by Adeli
Pegasus, the pick breaking and the golems, wizards etc, are from the game-that-shall-not-be-named aren\'t they? I had wondered at the reason for easily mended pick axes myself. Stupid game really, also, it never stopped bots, there were heaps.

Yeah the golem and pick axe are from the game-that-shall-not-be-named. I still have an account there i created like 3 years ago. Back then you could easily use auto mine (and many people did). I checked it out like 2 weeks ago and apart from the graphics and those random events not much has changed (it still is the same treadmill and probably will always be).

PS probably doesnt need things like random events because boters will be visible to a \"trained eye\".

Edit: Removed 1x \'probably\'

[Syzerian]

Just because it is from runescape it doesnt mean its a bad thing

[Clopy]

Originally posted by Adeli
I agree with Grono...

I think it was Einstein who said
\"The only constant in the universe is human stupidity\"

Never underestimate the possible stupidity of others.

Einstein actually said:
\"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I\'m not sure about the former.\"

[Adeli]

Thankyou Clopy!
I\'d forgotten the other half, I knew it didn\'t look right, but I was tired and confused. It\'s my friend\'s favourite saying.
Einstein was great, in that regard.

I wasn\'t saying that just because it is from runescape, it is bad, I was just asking if that\'s what he was talking about. I even have an account there, but haven\'t been on it for many months.

[Seytra]

Originally posted by Gronomist

Bad players are L33ter players, cheaters , ebayers and etc.

How will this be controlled?

As for the ebayers. I don\'t really see them problem with them. If people are willing (and stupid) enough to buy stuff for real money, then I say let them. But that\'s not really up to me. That\'s for Talad to decide.

I definitely see a problem with this, and it\'s called \"harvesting\". If ppl. just sell their stuff on ebay and other ppl. actually want to spend real money on it, I\'m fine with this (though I doubt paladin will be fine with that ).

However, in other games there are groups of ppl. \"playing\" for the sole purpose of harvesting things that they then sell on ebay. These ppl. actually destroy the game because they

1) frequent public places to harvest, thereby ruining the experience of others

2) actively drive off others if these enter the harvesting zone, usually done by creating trains and driving them towards the player

3) clog the server for their own selfish interests, thereby stealing other\'s resources, just like SPAMmers.

Therefore, I wish the most draconic punishments possible to be placed on them on the first occurence. At least a permanent ban!

[Xordan]

Originally posted by Seytra

Originally posted by Gronomist

Bad players are L33ter players, cheaters , ebayers and etc.

How will this be controlled?

As for the ebayers. I don\'t really see them problem with them. If people are willing (and stupid) enough to buy stuff for real money, then I say let them. But that\'s not really up to me. That\'s for Talad to decide.

I definitely see a problem with this, and it\'s called \"harvesting\". If ppl. just sell their stuff on ebay and other ppl. actually want to spend real money on it, I\'m fine with this (though I doubt paladin will be fine with that ).

However, in other games there are groups of ppl. \"playing\" for the sole purpose of harvesting things that they then sell on ebay. These ppl. actually destroy the game because they

1) frequent public places to harvest, thereby ruining the experience of others

2) actively drive off others if these enter the harvesting zone, usually done by creating trains and driving them towards the player

3) clog the server for their own selfish interests, thereby stealing other\'s resources, just like SPAMmers.

Therefore, I wish the most draconic punishments possible to be placed on them on the first occurence. At least a permanent ban!

Um, first, what has paladin got to do with people using ebay??? It can\'t detect stuff like that -_-.

And secondly, yeah, sites which you can buy stuff off usually ruin a game, as it destroys the economy. Just look at SWG for a good example. You can buy 100000 credits for about ?15. That\'s enough to get the best armour, weapons, vehices, house, and other amazing extras. So basically, every newbie who starts the game can get powerful fast. Also, you don\'t see many people running around who havn\'t hit the few mill credit limit.

[Seytra]

Originally posted by Xordan
Um, first, what has paladin got to do with people using ebay??? It can\'t detect stuff like that -_-.

I think it can, albeit indirectly. Because what happens after the stuff has been sold via ebay is that it\'s going to be given to some other player for zero (or almost zero) return. This is highly unusual behaviour and therefore readily detectable.
The same goes for putting things into chests and having other ppl. take them out again.

[mikewsnc]

idiot control? are you telling me there might be people who dont know how to role play.....no way.

[jorrit]

Originally posted by Seytra

Originally posted by Xordan
Um, first, what has paladin got to do with people using ebay??? It can\'t detect stuff like that -_-.

I think it can, albeit indirectly. Because what happens after the stuff has been sold via ebay is that it\'s going to be given to some other player for zero (or almost zero) return. This is highly unusual behaviour and therefore readily detectable.
The same goes for putting things into chests and having other ppl. take them out again.

This kind of behaviour is readily detectable by a human person. Doing it in an automated process is another matter though. That starts to sound like you need AI techniques for that.

Greetings,

[Seytra]

Originally posted by jorrit
This kind of behaviour is readily detectable by a human person. Doing it in an automated process is another matter though. That starts to sound like you need AI techniques for that.

I was thinking about a rather simple approach, like:

1) person gives item of value (may also be money) to another person.
2) the other person gives nothing or only items of low value (including money) to the first person within a given time, say, 24 hours RL time

Or

1) person places item of value in some crate
2) another person takes the contents of the crate
3) the other person neither puts anything of equal value back into the crate, nor does it transfer anything else to the first person (directly or indirectly).

The key might be to trace the movement of each item, at least the most recent 20 different persons that owned it, NPCs not included. However, this might not be feasible considering the resources, so it may be reduced to items of considerable value, which will be a lot rarer.

Also, if you do this trace, you can easily spot ppl. who do this kind of thing frequently, which will always happen with harvesters (they do nothing else). You just need to attach some statistics to each char, in which you log the number of \"dubious transactions\", and if they go over a certain threshold, a \"harvester alert\" is triggered.

An AI would of course be helpful, but the moral implications of creating one aren\'t nice.

@ mikewsnc: idiot control: you can set the \"idiot level\", just as you can set brightness level. Also, there can be \"idiot correction\", as with gamma correction. It\'d be a neat feat.

[jorrit]

Originally posted by Seytra
I was thinking about a rather simple approach, like:

1) person gives item of value (may also be money) to another person.
2) the other person gives nothing or only items of low value (including money) to the first person within a given time, say, 24 hours RL time

I don\'t think you should punish someone for being kind and just giving something for free to someone else. Strange as it may sound to some people, this actually does happen :-)

Also, if you do this trace, you can easily spot ppl. who do this kind of thing frequently, which will always happen with harvesters (they do nothing else). You just need to attach some statistics to each char, in which you log the number of \"dubious transactions\", and if they go over a certain threshold, a \"harvester alert\" is triggered.

Yes, that might be possible.

Greetings,

[Adeli]

I definitely agree with Jorrit on the first point.
Just the other day, I join an Ultima Online shard.
After trying to work out what to do, a pc walks up to me...\"hi are you new?\" when I said yes he told me to follow him.
In the next 10 minutes he proceeded to craft me an entire set of exquisite leather armour, a sword and shield, a cloak and robe, and let me use his dyes to colour them,  tamed a horse and gave it to me, went on the first quest with me, and then took me to a suitable place to build a house.
I don\'t think people like this should be punished for helping out a fellow player. I myself always helped out newer players when I played Diablo 2.

I guess we have to hope that the community (albeit a larger version of it) is mature enough not to have some ruin it all for others. If I\'m rambling, it\'s due to two hours sleep, before a whole day of uni, so sorry.

[Zeraph]

Agara may fit the profile of a harvester because she does the crystal drops.. your going to get lots of good people flagged for this because they give money to newbies to help them out... if I create a new char then I would definitely have my other chars give them stuff like \"a gift from a rich uncle\" as I can put it in RP, I usually help my new chars out so I do not have to do all the newbie stuff for a couple of days that can take a couple of hours with help.... but anyway, I do not really care if ppl are buying PS money on ebay, that\'s just a stupid thing to do imo. & if harvesters are crowding out other ppl being rude ppl will report them to gms & if they do not respond (like they are a bot) then the gms will probably kick them for inactivity for a couple of hours or whatnot...

edit: Exactly Adeli, I would always help out newbies in other games. if I was board I could always find some ignorant newb to help out... That\'s just how I am..

[Seytra]

I wasn\'t talking about common stuff. I was talking about things that have value for advanced players, not for newbies. I doubt anyone will just give away their newly found \"Sword of 1337\", it it were worth a pterosaur or two.

Edit: If you do, please contact me!

Quest reward items of really difficult quests, stuff like that. Nobody is going to buy a leather armor or a horse (an ingame one, that is) on ebay IMO.
And I doubt that any community of significant size will ever be mature enough to police itself appropriately. I\'ve not heard about one MMORPG where this was the case.
Also, there are entire company-like establishments in places like Corea that have ppl. working to harvest in MMORPGs, and then sell the stuff on ebay. So it\'s not a minor thing, it\'s more like organised crime to me.

Anyway, harvesters powerlevel to the level at which the most interesting items are most frequently being dropped by mobs, and then they grind these mobs repeatedly, carefully selecting the party members for highest drop rate. Once they have gained too many levels to get decent drops, they let themselves be killed repeatedly to loose the extra levels, so that they can harvest again.

Clearly, this is, at best, abuse of the system.