Author Topic: The new 50 slash damage wepons  (Read 6329 times)

Nikodemus

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The new 50 slash damage wepons
« on: August 21, 2005, 12:36:07 pm »
For those who don\'t know yet, since this update there is quite big chance to loot such weapon from mercenaries, gladiators, rogues, bandits and similiar. These weapons have the same speed as weapons at smiths and merchants, but damage these weapons inflict is disproportionately bigger, 50, 54, 30, 20 base damage.

I write about this, because i find it very wrong such weapons exist and can be generated, because of below reasons. I would like also to hear who thinks (after reading my post) there is nothing wrong in these new weapons and maybe see comment of someone responsible. Thank you

I don\'t know how to explain their existance and this spoils my roleplaying experience in this world. What are they? A super unique magic enchanted weapons with extremaly sharp blade? For sure not unique as i see them on every step and sold myself a few. Magically enchanted and sharpened don\'t sound right too. Is it really that simple to make that many weapons, so much powerfull? Why don\'t harnquist sell such then? these weapons aren\'t unique, but of common use. A cook can prepare a dinner with \"sapphire encrusted frosty dagger of defender\" ;)

What do happen because of existence of new uber weapons.
There is no longer need to use normal old good weapons. Why when we can use 25 times more pewerfull version?
One can say: I wan\'t to inflict 200 damage instead of 30.
For not skilled newbie it will be 50 damage instead of 2.
Yes, a newbie can challange you to a duel and kill with 2 blows, when you think you are skilled^^.  That newbie don\'t have to train, but if he would, it wouldn\'t take long he kill you with one blow.
Skills don\'t matter that much is they did and I always believed it are the skills which proclaim of fighters quality.
Where before one could increase base damage of his sword like 25 times by training proper skill, now (i don\'t know how high people trained, but from my experience and observation) he can do it like only 4 times.
Sure it is very easy to make such weapon in a game and most people will care only about it is so much better weapon than previous version. And every update we can have more tought mobs and more powerfull weapons.  The mindless masses will shout everytime such thing will happen that it is so good, because they can become more powerfull. But will they really be? I would compare this to the inflation, only in this case it shouldn\'t rise.

I cant recall any more reasons, although there are probably a few which i have missed. Maybe i have missed all the reasons which tells the mentioned weapons are right? I don\'t know. But replying be wise in this what you write.
I wonder what will be result here, because ingame for 4 asked people only 1 started thinking that indeed maybe it is not right with those 50dmg weapons.

Thank you for reading



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Valbrandr

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« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2005, 12:58:32 pm »
I believe the Devs are just testing the item generator...  though I can see what you mean.  Depending on how soon we can get these weapons.. when the testing is done, is going to change alot.  All of us are going to need more HP... and it will have to be more feasible then powering up EN.  Now all we need is a level system in which we gain HP after each lvl j/k.  But seriously, hopefully Body Development will be implemented soon after to counteract the weapons.. oh and armor too  :D

rosmerelmer

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« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2005, 06:10:00 pm »
what i don\'t understand is how the names are generated.. or did they just made a huuuuuge list of such things?

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Zan

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« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2005, 06:20:49 pm »
Well I \'ve actually seen it like this ... before we were sold pretty crappy weaponry which often took dozens of hits to slay a simple unarmed person. Basically a blunt metal object in my eyes. while these new uber weapons as you call em seem more realistic to me .. one or two clean hits kill.

That way a warrior with a decent sword needs to rely on avoiding and blocking skills, in other words agility and armor or shield handling. Along with this a higher skill level shouldn\'t so much increase damage but increase the chance of a hit versus a blocked attack or miss.

I personally think such a system would be more realistic and better RP material.
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SuburbanPlankton

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« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2005, 06:24:20 pm »
Quote
but damage these weapons inflict is disproportionately bigger, 50, 54, 30, 20 base damage.


I have a question about weapons, and this seems as good a place as any to ask it.  How do you know what the base damage of any particular weapon is?  Is this something that you can look up in-game, or do you need to extrapolate it from the damage you do when you use it?

Along the same lines, does combat damage in PS work along \"traditional\" lines?  That is, damage = weapon\'s base damage + (attack strength * some multiplier) - (defense strength * multiplier)?  Is it possible to look up these values, or can we only estimate them from observing the action?

ilBaal

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« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2005, 06:45:00 pm »
You can check this in-game. Simply click on the weapon of your choice, go over the eye-symbol and click again.
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Jakob

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« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2005, 06:57:43 pm »
You know... That really shouldn\'t be available... I can\'t go into a sword shop, pick up a nice blade and say...\"Oh! this blade has a 73 base attack!\"  But I digress...

As for uber(I thought we didn\'t like saying that kind of thing here...) weapons...  I agree that they do make things more realistic in fights against humanoid type critters and Yliaki.  But agians things with strong natural armor, instead of the monsters defences kicking in, the blade just should do less damage in general, and after bashing off somethings shell should just simply become dull, or even normal.

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Nikodemus

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« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2005, 10:20:43 pm »
Zan: I agree the system should allow better way of developing avoiding and blocking skills. Training skills like using sword or axe shouldn\'t only increase the damage, but the chance to block enemy blows. A shield should give really a lot of protection.
But I won\'t call old weapons crappy, they still killed people with 2 hits if owner was skilled enough, dozens of hits was needed when unskilled person calling himself a warrior was learning to use his/her weapon. At some rank, the damage increase per next rank became really small and even smaller. At this point i would call someone skilled. He (person A) spent a bit more than half time training than another better skilled person B and he (person A) was almost that good than the person B. It wasn\'t bad at all.
Last, i think it isn\'t that good you get killed wit one blow. I did thought like this, but..... It is like that in real world. There  one is thinking a lot faster having all the fealings you don\'t have yet in virtual world. He can react a lot faster on the tiny precious changes which are happening during a fight. Thus to give somethink instead, we have hit points. Not healt (i know nobody mentioned it) but hit. Two people are fighting and they get tired by time, are hit not very badly in not that importants parts of body, which exhause them even more. Finally one of them makes a fatal mistake and get killed with final blow of his opponent.
Of course striking unarmed person who nothing about martial arts and avoiding hits or striking from suprise is deadly for the attacked person, but i believe we will have to wait with this before it will be implemented.
Thats the way how i would explain it. this give time to react, because of lack of this what we have in real world. Especially thinking about ps system where two players press one key on their keyboard (or click mouse) to start attack (the one who press it faster the better for him) and look at your char attacking
And please don\'t propose increasing damage per hit, because as i wrote in my last post this will lead use to constant increasing and soon people will see nothing wrong in hitting people for 1000 damage.
I would rather ask to decrease health of NPC\'s. I find it weird that a mercenary have like 3 times more health than me, and rogues or gladiators even more.  decrease their healt, but give them skills to defend from incoming hits.
With tefusangs and other big animals it is another matter, because they can naturally take more hits, but still it should be proportional.

As about body development skill.....
I don\'t really know what it is. It makes one more fat, so that he is bigger and can take more hits like ulbernauts? :)   Maybe he is more resilient and don\'t get tired that fast in the system interpretation i gave above. But then i think he should train endurance agility and strenght which do give more hp. Add to this body development? I dont see a place for this skill. Arguments?
i don\'t see why we will need more hp, it can be raised quite high already. Do we need to raise it even more too 300, 400? I wrote few times it will lead in wrong way.

SuburbanPlankton: from this what I think I heard the system is far more complex and so i think.

Jakob: I agree it would be better if the way how the sword look like would tell if it is good or not. the sharper the better. magic enchanted? Good too. The metal from which it has been made is also important. We don\'t have too see the stats although they imitate this what we would know in real. I still think the stats tell too much as we don\'t know most informations about a weapon in the moment we see it. Note that the chance or factor how often one will hit with the weapon and how good it is for defence aren\'t given.
I mentioned about stats in my post to give image of the situation. If I haven\'t the stats in the item description I would know it by using and testing the weapon.

I have forgotten one thing in my first post. I don\'t see much wrong in a magic enchanted weapon which deals additionally 4-6 more base damage as the magic power makes them more sharp or whatever.

I know everybody love long posts, but i couldn\'t make it shorter.



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Jakob

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« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2005, 10:30:36 pm »
Long posts aren\'t that bad, at least not if the person who is typing them is reasonably intelligent and has something interesting to say.  I agree with a lot of what you just said.  The only thing is, you say that \"Of course striking unarmed person who nothing about martial arts and avoiding hits or striking from suprise is deadly for the attacked person.\"  I\'m not really sure I agree with that, neccessarily.  I think a persons willpower, physical, and mental stamina should come into play to determine the fatality of a sneak attack on an unarmed and untrained.  I\'m sure you agree that no one should have anything even remotely close to an automatic kill unless they have some kind of super Dark Way Spell or powerful, and magically enchanted, weapon.

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dragonfire999

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« Reply #9 on: August 22, 2005, 03:43:12 am »
Well, given that everyone now has the \"Ub3r l337 fi34 4X30rz 0f d00mz\" I have generally gave up on combat, because i am not looking to get my skull smashed in by one of the damn new people that Shalmaneser gave axes to after camping for two hours killing the merc with one hit. I just got two regular daggers and started using them in training.

I hope the dev\'s fix this. because it is pointless if you ask me.

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Keyaz

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« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2005, 04:21:19 am »
eeeverything will be fine, we\'ve... wait... im not a dev :\'(

they\'ve got more important things to work on now instead of run around doing all your little quirks, once they decide its balanced nicely enough and implemented and cleared bugs for as much as they want added in, then they will sort out prblems such as these.

get used to not knowing here, because infact, even the Dev\'s dont know when stuff will happen, its a spare time rpoject, it all happens in the spare of the moment.

enjoy!

Neryam

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« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2005, 04:56:05 am »
I dunno, I like these uber-weapons but I wish there were a widr range of damages and the strongest ones would be ultra-rare, so that not everone had or could get them.

And many of the \"of the defender\" and \"of stone\" are exactly the same power as the normal, they should be diffrent or perhaps even raise defence. :D

And they should look diffrent too.. like fire would be glowing red..
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Keyaz

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« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2005, 05:56:15 am »
again, later, stuiff to do

Drey

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« Reply #13 on: August 22, 2005, 07:59:17 am »
i think the weapons with 30+ slash are over the top (dont stop me using them though) but at the moment i think they are kinda needed with the NPCs having the ammount of HP that they have, not like rats but things like rogues and trepors and gladiators, the stronger monsters, you dont stand too much of a chance when hitting less than 100 unless you are runnign round like mad or have the enemy stuck somewhere.
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Pestilence

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« Reply #14 on: August 22, 2005, 01:12:08 pm »
hmmm agree with drey. I have 50 slash axes and when I first got them I was like WOHOO noone\'s gonna touch me now.

But some monsters seem to have gotten some major upgrades in HP aswell. Anyhow the wipe is soming to take our weapons away and after that the 50 weapons should be much rarer. They already tweaked the mercs droprate and the rest will surely follow I am sure ;)