Shadow in the Hills critique

[zorbels]

* Xillix Queen of Fools Handglides in dressed in fur and goggles.

@zorbels

ain't none o ya so bad . . .

@Me consistent across alot of threads of late are varying interpretaions of how to roleplay and what the ps limitations to that are. . .

I am sorry Xillix Queen of Fools I don't understand the @Zorbels  statement. 

  I agree there is alot of threads on what to do and what not to do, but that is how things are worked out no? This is how we all establish boundries with the game. If anything I think we are lucky that the dev team takes what we say and listens to the community. What would happen if they took that away? How would you feel to be told you HAVE to roleplay a certain way because that is how a certain Dev would and he made the rules so you have to follow them, otherwise get kicked?

[Waylander]

The forums really don't have all that many flames in them.  And yes, people disagree with how to roleplay, all in all I like what Zorbels said about agreeing and disagreeing with certain events in a roleplay.  We are all experimenting more or less with how to do this stuff, I mean, we all come from different backgrounds and, for the most part, have been in games like WoW and EQ2 and so have a terrible view of what roleplaying is

It's good that we have threads like this to discuss how to do things, and the only reason there are any flames is because some of us won't let other people change their mind.  You may be wrong, here, admit it and change, nobody will think of you as weak for changing your views on roleplay.

And if you don't agree with a roleplay that doesn't mean you have to insult the person who roleplays it that way.  Just tell them your concerns, or post the concerns on the forums and move on.  There are trolls ingame just as there are trolls in the forums.

And Xillix, tell the new players that they are more than welcome to post here, if anything they will bring an interesting perspective and a less biased opinion than most.

[zanzibar]

The forums really don't have all that many flames in them.

Yup.  It's pretty much just disputes between specific individuals.  The only flaming outside of that is towards new players who make "silly" wish list suggestions, and in those cases it's pretty tame.

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

Zorbels i just meant that i know that these forums are not as bad as some make them out to be. Sometimes the tone can seem very ominous and because it is text only it leaves a great deal of room for miscommunication. An awareness of this fact and a severe endeavor to avoid trixier ways of speaking might help. Sarcasm for instance does not seem to come out as well without a human face to let you know it is a joke a well intentioned jab as opposed to an Ill intentioned stab.

In terms of how to roleplay I know that the way this argument about how to RP plays out in the forum is on an instance by instance basis, but this means the people who need the advice most will not get it. People who read and follow the forums will have a greater understanding of what consensus has been reached among the players of PS but honestly almost none of the new players I have aided could give two dingo's kidneys about the forums, their loss? Or ours? I suggest lifting some advice from the individual threads wherein these ideas are discussed and plugging them back into the rp thread under newbie help. I might like to see some advice on roleplaying migrated to the mainsite for the purpose of setting the tone for the incoming player. A great deal of text is generated on this forum and it will certainly seem intimidating to the average person.

One thing I loved about this game from the outset was the supportive helpful community and especially the climate of roleplaying. I am a long time veteran rper and I have had some of my favorite rp experiences of all time in this game. The Vespers have worked very hard to instill a sense of respect for that environment in over two hundred new players now. Do they all care? not remotely. Those who have cared have gone on to join and be productive members of several guilds now. Some people have comment in game that they have noticed a change. I would like to see some of the roleplaying advice institutionalized we can continue to haggle here, but some guidelines cleary labeled and readily available on the the main page (or perhaps in the players guide?) might do a bit toward alleviating some of the issues that arise from varied interpretations of roleplaying.

@ all established players go back and read the rp thread in newbie help I had a good experience rereading it perhaps you will as well.

[ Careful with your language! --Karyuu ]

[zorbels]

A great deal of text is generated on this forum and it will certainly seem intimidating to the average person.

  Thank you for clearing that up Xillix, I understand what you were trying to say now. To what I have quoted, I understand completely how intimidating these forums, or any forums for that matter can seem. These are the first forums I have ever had the pleasure of being apart of. It took time to get used to them, but you must spend time in them to grow comfortable. You can tell when I started to grow more at ease as my posts got longer, and I voiced my opinion when I felt I should. I just believe the newbies should try to check things out before taking on an opinion about the forums, especially someone elses when they so clearly have never been to the forums. You will always have the ones who talk to much, or flame, or don't really make points in their posts. Guess what... we have that in real life as well. Only that is in your face, deal with it now. That is the beauty of these forums, you don't have to answer or pay attention to negitivity. You can state your opinion and be done with it. Such a lovely bonus .... now if only I could figure out how to impliment forums in real life ....  

[Xillix Queen of Fools]

dingo's kidneys? 

Point taken

[zorbels]

dingo's kidneys? 

Point taken

No thanks i don't want a dingo's kidneys. A pet kangaroo would be neat though. 

[Under the moon]

*edit* this post applies to issues brought up in the SRP thread. Sorry for any confuzzlation.

Odd. I have the worst connection on the planet, my pc maxes out the processor on one single PS (not the 1.5 gigs of mem, though), and I was dual clienting. I had little problem with lag. The game ran smooth enough to see all of the fight with both characters. However, I made sure to turn off the sound, set to a small window, and cut the distance down to less than 40. I believe the greatest lag came from the client side, not the server. Be sure to minimize -all- you can clientside before going into a group of folks this large. Last count I was given was 40+ on Light, 30+ on Dark, 35+ Mobs. A good turnout.

As the the /challenge or /guildwar issue, I have suggested a /groupwar option to the devs also. This would allow anyone from any guild -or of none at all- to join in the battle on one side or the other (or maybe more than two sides). This would work just the same as guildwarring, only with temp Battlegroups. Options could be coded in to permit number of DR returns to the battlegroup, or not. Other options that could work would be Commanders and ranks. /challenge would be replaced with /attack, just as if your foe was a Mob.

Now, to prevent this from becoming a PvP spamming 'OMGzorZ comz jion my batle!!' kind of thing, I would suggest that a GM must give the Groupbattle leaders 'permission' to form the groups, and threads be formed explaining -exactly- what this battle was to be. Battles are EVENTS, not a way of life. Sometimes RP calls for them, but it is not needed for normal gameplay.

Also, it was fun after things came together (sort of).

[narita]

As far as players complaining about potions being used and such, I thought that was a little funny - this was war, not a practice duel. There were no combat conditions stipulated. The goodies at least were distributing good weapons and potions to their guildmates and friends. The most ironic part to me is how most such grievances were coming from the baddies side!! Who would have thought they would be complaining that the goodies weren't chivelrous enough   !

Maybe it was a war, but it was supposed to be roleplayed. Instant heal system, including potion, are bugs and advertise there usage is meaningless.

Before the event,  I was close to post "indeed, potions and other bug exploit are not allowed", but it would have  been unkind. I should have post this anyway then decide to stay at home according the replies.

[JohnB]

As far as players complaining about potions being used and such, I thought that was a little funny - this was war, not a practice duel. There were no combat conditions stipulated. The goodies at least were distributing good weapons and potions to their guildmates and friends. The most ironic part to me is how most such grievances were coming from the baddies side!! Who would have thought they would be complaining that the goodies weren't chivelrous enough   !

Maybe it was a war, but it was supposed to be roleplayed. Instant heal system, including potion, are bugs and advertise there usage is meaningless.

Before the event, the I was close to post "indeed, potions and other bug exploit are not allowed", but it would have  been unkind. I should have post this anyway then decide to stay at home according the replies.

Well, I was using potions (while being hit by Energy Arrows by unseen attackers while fighting the monsters) - nobody told us not to.  I'm new to PvP, so not familiar with the dos nd don'ts (this battle seemed like a good way to try some PvP combat, but it didn't work out that way - I never found anyone who was accepting attacks and was struck down for challenging, like many others.

The point is, if there are rules like this, they need to be decided on in advance, then posted along with the arrangements for the battle on the forums, and repeated many times unambiguously in game by the commanders (who should also have been appointed in advance, and shown up early and worked hard at organising things).  That way people would be right to complain if others used potions, but as it was, we weren't told not to.  There was a brief discussion on the hill before the battle, but no decision (and nobody in charge) so everyone had to make up their own minds.

[Bebel]

I played as an npc for this RP to help; I respected the RP background of the battle and that's why I didn't use potions.
I stayed in DR after the death for the realism, but some of the good side asked me to come back telling me "You have 3 life, come back and fight you are missing the fun".
If you want that kind of fun , I mean a OOC fight for fun, just post a new battle event without all the rp mascarad behind like " HUGE battle, come and kill all you can kill, 3 life allowed, bugs allowed ( potions ), no fee entrance !!!  ".

[zorbels]

bugs allowed ( potions ).

  Now where in ps history does it say that potions are bugs? For that matter if they were, why would the dev's have not removed them a long time ago? Potions are not a bugs, they are part of the game. There were no rules that I could find stating that you could not us potions in this battle. If you had something of an issue with potions being used in the battle, maybe stating that on this thread before the battle took place might have helped, instead of complaining about it after.   

[ou8i8uo]

I have to disagree with Setill and Narita. Potions are not bugs but if you want realism, they should not be able to be used when engaged in fighting. Think about it, a sword in each hand, how would you reach into your pack and drink potions while fending off an attacker?
I think it is ok to use them if youre stepping back out of the fray and noone is hitting you.
Anyways, even so, I think the potions kind of even out the fact that every challenge I sent to the bad guys was declined and I was spam penalized for it.
Funny how everyone could attack me but I could not attack back. Pretty clever of the bad guys, I must say.

[zorbels]

This I just found and I believe it would make perfect sense. It would throw that pesky realisim remark out the door. 

It's quite possible to drink a potion during a fight, and not OOC. However, I think we should penalise for it. I would like it if non-combat actions gave a malus to your defense for say 1 second or so (time depending on the action). So swapping a weapon, drinking a potion, etc. would make you vunerable for a short time.

Also I'd like us to have 'hunger' and 'thirst', where you can only eat or drink when you're not full. Should stop people drinking 10 potions during a fight. I think SWG used something like this and it was very effective.

Note: This quote was posted in the wishlist section of the forums.

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Funny how everyone could attack me but I could not attack back.

Yup i have issues with that myself. I thought that everyone was supposed to be on auto accept challenge that includes the baddies. Only none of the baddies seemed to be attackable. I, at one point had a group of them attack me. I had just finished a battle with setill and had 24% life. I used a potion so that I could turn and fight the group, I see nothing wrong with that. Nothing is perfect.

[Bebel]

i guess who died didn't put the challenge to auto decline.