Little-boy-with-wooden-swords

[Monketh]

Let's Re-rail the thread.

This approach definitely (though reasonable given the situation) has the potential to be abused by the very persons who it is meant to be targeted at.

[Parallo]

Let's Re-rail the thread.

Good thinking. Sorry.
I think its a good humoured idea. Its propably the most light hearted way we can deal with these 'idiots' as they have been dubed and its not like anyone is actualy going to have their feelings hurt by being told they can't rp well. Its just a game!

[Pestilence]

Well think it's a good way to deal with it and might try it myself, but agree making it a forum post will probably just give ideas to the wrong kind of people aswell.

[zanzibar]

Plus think back to your character Haunt.  This is almost exactly what I did to him:  I treated him as a normal person who was either deluded or highly imaginative.  You weren't too appreciative of that, as I recall.

[Under the moon]

*grins*
And if it had worked, I would have stopped using that character. It did not work, if you recall. In fact, other characters in the tavern started to treat your character as if he was insane for not seeing the haunt as they did. That was with no prompting from me at all. A well played character is a powerful tool, and sometimes a weapon.

The key is getting others to agree with you that the other person's actions are uncalled for in the situation, and therefore subject to this treatment. In that way, it is hard to abuse. No one is going to go along with an 'ubertweaking' if no one agrees that the actions are uncalled for. In my fictional example, Boon could have started tweaking that Hyuken was a child, but would anybody else have gone along with it? No. That is where good roleplaying comes into play. You can only tweak something that is breaking the 'reality' of a situation. If you start doing something like this just because someone rubbed you the wrong way, it will not work. A player's perception of a character can only be changed if they think it needs to be changed. Just as your character's perception of mobs is that they do not spring out of the empty air at perfectly timed intervals, or the fools shouting over and over about wanting a 'sord'. These things are not seen or heard by our characters because they would not realistically happen. This takes it one step more, and let's the offending player know that they are acting unrealistically in no uncertain terms.

The example I gave is based on the times I have done this. Every time I have done it, it has worked. People will start to treat the character as the child my character now sees. Why? Because that character is acting like a child, so the tranfer is easy to make in people's minds.

Could a person new to the game do this to a disruptive player? Yes. All it takes is a little well played RP, and a character who is 'asking' for it.

Some game mechanics need to be glazed over for the good of RP, and so to do the actions of some players.

This is my stand, and it will not change. Power to the Roleplayers.

[zanzibar]

It's difficult to abuse power if you have a group of people backing you up?  Yeah.  Right.

[Phinehas]

What he's saying, as you would understand if you tried being objective, is that he's saying that whether or not this succeeds is not up to him, it's up to the others around him to judge and decide, therefore he's more like a prosecuting attorney befoer a jury, as opposed to the dictator you seem to be making him into.

[zanzibar]

Disagreeing with someone doesn't mean they're not being objective.  I know what he was trying to say, but there was a problem in the way he said it.

[zorbels]

Ok I am going to break this down and type out what I see and give my opinion on this post as I assume that is what moon would like. My opinion is coming from a roleplayers point of view, NOT from an ooc point of view.

Boon: Give me a drink or I will crush you all.

This character I assume is in character as he hasn’t stated that he isn’t. It is obvious this character is very agitated, demanding, used to getting his own way by force.

Hyuken: Sir, the Boss don't let me serve people with swords out.

That is an ideal response from Hyuken as his character from what I know of him is polite and respectful of others.

Illiky nods and looks at the swords.

Nothing much to say about that.

Boon: WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING AT? give me a drink now!!!

This character sees that his demands are not taken seriously and decides to up his aggression. Nothing wrong with this so far that I can tell.  He is still in character and hasn’t given the face behind the player (Hyuken) a reason to think otherwise.

Hyuken tells Boon: Please tone down what you are doing. This would get you tossed out of a tavern.

Again perfect response from this character as we know Hyuken is a bartender for kada’s and he likes to keep the peace and follow the rules.

Boon tells you: I am evil and will do what I want. stop being a whiner.

This sentence makes it clear that this might be a new RP, or an inexperienced one that is on their path to learning the skills of a RP.

If you are evil, you don’t announce it to the world. Being evil doesn’t mean to be as loud as you can, call names or even steal stuff. Most characters that are evil don’t roleplay that they know they are. They just are. Now if it was me in this situation I would have gave this Boon guy the benefit of the doubt that he might be a new roleplayer. I would applaud him for his efforts and maybe send him a /tell giving him my suggestions on how to roleplay an evil character or links on the forums or other websites where he can look up information to help get him started on creating an "evil" character. I would also /tell him what would keep me interested in this roleplay with him.

Hyuken: Sir, I ask you agin to put away your swords and be more polite, or I will call the guards in here and have you removed. Boss's rules.

Again Hyuken is being his usual self and warning the new comer that this type of behavior will not be accepted. So far so good …..

Boon: The guards can't do anything to me. they are as weak as you.

Your typical tough guy. He is letting moons character know that he isn’t going to back down. For some reason the Boon character is very agitated and wants to pick a fight with someone. Hyuken just happen to be the perfect target. Though annoying, there has been nothing done wrong yet in my eyes when it comes to roleplaying.

Boon looms over you and makes your heart full of fear.

This in my opinion should never, NEVER, be done. You take away the characters right to react to you. You cannot roleplay people’s characters for them and they must have the freedom to react to a situation the way they feel their character would. Example: Boon looms over Hyuken hoping to instill fear into the menki with his hard icy stare.

Doing this will allow  Hyuken to react in one of two ways. He could be feeling brave that day and not feel threatened by Boon and ignore the icy stare. Or Hyuken can roleplay out that he is scared of Boon.

Hyuken tells Boon: Last warning. there are laws that you must RP by.

This here is totally OOC, and something that surprises me with Hyuken. I am not sure why you had to take this direction Moon. I see no where that Boon broke any roleplay rules. I just see that you are not in the mood to play with the new roleplayer and the same old, some old roleplay we see from these newbies trying to play evil.

Boon: Laws mean NOTHING to me! give me a drink or I will stab your face.

Still roleplaying his aggressive bad self.

Hyuken: [[very well, you were warned]]

If this was a newbie it wasn’t much of a warning and certainly not one a newbie would understand. If I was in this position I would send a /tell to this character informing them of why they are losing my interest in this roleplay. Then I would suggest certain things to keep my interest or I would ask the Boon character to leave me be as I don’t want to roleplay with his character at the moment.

Hyuken looks over the bar to see a little boy banging his wooden playswords against the side. "Hello there, Boon. Does your mother know you are here?

This is just down right taunting this character now. I know we all have our bad days and unfortunately moon has posted his. There was no reason for this as other more peaceful ways could have been taken. /tells, ignoring, giving helpful hints, or simple roleplaying into the aggression and having your character give in and give Boon a drink so that he would go away. I do wonder after this sentence “WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING AT? give me a drink now!!!” what would have happened if you gave him a drink? Would he have left it at that? Or caused more disruption? Would Boon have calmed down after having a drink and would Hyuken make a friend? This could have gone so many ways ......

Boon: what are you talking about? don't make me cut you

Still roleplaying and ignoring Moons OOC comments. When IC I think that is the right thing to do.

Hyuken: Oh, she sent you to bring some cookies to the tavern. You are such a good boy. I see your father made you another wooden sword to go with your other.

Again just taunting and not really helping the situation. My head is screaming “Why didn’t you just ignore this guy’s roleplay if you didn’t want to play? Instead you decide to ruin his? You could easily tell him you are just not willing to Rp with him today. This to me doesn’t make sense as I know that Moon likes to have the same respect. This is why I draw on the assumtion that moon is having a bad day.

Boon: I am going to kill you!

Still RPing away. I see no breaking of the rules for moon to treat this character in the manner he is.

Hyuken: That is so cute! Isn't he the nicest little boy you know, Illiky? Always polite and caring.

And more taunting.

Hyuken: Would you like some of the cookies Boon brought for us? His mother is the best cook.

Now this is just plain crappy. How do you know his mother? You don’t. So you can’t possibly be IC. Even OOC why are you still trying to RP? Can you not just simply tell Boon that you don’t want to roleplay with him? Instead of trying to frustrate him. If you think this was enjoyable for me to read …. It really wasn’t to be honest with you moon. I think communication and trying to work out differences is much better then trying to goat someone into a fight just because you don't agree with their RP style.

Boon reaches over and cuts Hyuken throat.

A perfect reaction as far as I am concerned when it comes to this characters personality. You are mocking him and he is obviously very aggressive. Of course he is going to want to jump over the counter and show you what’s what. Now if this were me (I would still be IC) I would have dodged the attack and grabbed his arm, twisted it till the knife fell to the ground and then called for the guards.

Hyuken laughs as Boon pokes him with one of his blunted wooden swords. "Hey, that tickles little man. You not big enough to try to fight yet."

annnnnd still taunting ......

Illiky takes a cookie.

Hope you brushed your teeth after.

Hyuken bites a cookie and smiles.

Nothing much to say here .....

Boon: You did not, I killed you! stop godmodding

You can’t just walk up and kill someone with the way planeshift is set up. It is more complicated then that. Maybe next time go for a more realistic approach and cut his arm or something. I mean if it did work that way no one would be alive. I could just walk up to anyone and stab them, then say “Ha you’re dead.” How much fun would that be? Besides being evil doesn’t mean you go around killing everyone. You will just develop a rep for that and people won’t want to RP with you.

Hyuken: What was that? The other kids picked on you today? Well, don't be sad just because you are the littlest. You will grow up someday. Have one of your mother's cookies. She is such a nice lady.

Still taunting ……

Illiky: And a good cook too.

Others joining in on the taunting. Gezzzz, I feel like I am in a play ground with elementary students picking on the kid who wasn't like the rest of them.

Boon: you all suck with your bad RP and godmodding! go to hell.

Player finally gets frustrated with moons OOC comments and tells him what he thinks about that.

I give you a fictional example of a meeting in the tavern.

Over all I am not really sure what the point of this post was. I read it as a message to someone moon is ticked off at. Nothing more. This as moon said was fictional so I am not sure how much of this really took place and how much didn't. I do know with the "Fictional example"  that I strongly feel that this was not the way to deal with it. There are much better routes to take, ones which would be better examples to new or inexperienced Rper's. None of us are Super roleplayers, and we all have a lot to learn. Having patience with those who are not quite at your level of roleplay would be more helpful then taunting them when they obviously are not as skillful in it. 

  That's just my thoughts on the matter. Everyone is different.

[zanzibar]

Zorbels, I agree with your analysis entirely.

[Parallo]

Hyuken tells Boon: Last warning. there are laws that you must RP by

'tells' meaning that it was in fact done using a tell like you suggested.

[zorbels]

'tells' meaning that it was in fact done using a tell like you suggested.

Ya he used tells to say .....

Hyuken tells Boon: Last warning. there are laws that you must RP by

But what he said wasn't what I suggested. I suggested being helpful. I haven't a clue what "rules" Hyuken is referring  to so I must assume Boon is probably wondering himself.

[Parallo]

I suppose so but if he did that one step in a more acceptable manner then that in turn would have made the rest of the exchange fair, would it?  Hmmm. Its a tough one.

[zog]

it sounded to me as if the aggressor was new to RP ...new players need to be coached and guided ...not stomped and smashed into the shape you want

[zorbels]

* zorbels scratches Zog behind the ears and feeds him a strawberry

Exactly.