Can't understand your intentions

[Echoes91]

This is addressed to everybody who worked/works on this game. I've been around for some years now, even if playing very seldom and never writing on forum. I followed all the big progresses you made on this game, writing a 3D MMORPG from scratch to release as open source for free must be an exceptionally hard work and I've always been happy to test and support games and program for the GNU world, but unlucky I'm loosing hopes for this one.
A lot of playing hours have passed by, but my only character is still unable to complete most of the quests because of poor skills. I did my best to grind some of them, but when it takes DAYS of repetitions to level up enough the will passes. Why so much time and repetition? Is there any need to make the game not enjoyable? It seems like it wants to lead players to payed subscriptions even if there's no one. You could cut half the training times and still get a long lasting process.
And so came today, after more than 40 min WALKING, because obviously i have not a mount and nobody have been able to tell me how to get one, for the Bronze Doors through big empty spaces, because there are so few people around, some neither answer, and absolutely nobody out of the town to interact with, I came to this "labyrinth" where the uniform green color made impossible to tell how terrain was made. After another 20 minutes and 4 unsticks I fell into nowhere, died and respawned back to the start.
I understand that this is more testing than playing, but that's one more reason to let people test instead of let them pay for the game problems. Why can't we simply respawn where we died? Is the back of smith's shop someway special?
I'd not like to waste another hour like this, it seems to me that this game wants to keep a small elite of 20-30 players and push everybody else away. It's not wrong itself but is it really your intention after the huge job you've done? An MMRPG should rely on a MASSIVE playerbase, but it looks like this struggles to even have a playerbase

[Bonifarzia]

I doubt that the issues you have rightfully addressed here are in any way intended by current or former member of the dev team.
For example, I remember that a prominent and open minded rules dev has hinted to have no problems with scaling down the time requirements for skill training if that can improve the game experience. Also keep in mind that with the removal of skill theory training, things have already become much less tedious, and further tweaks are well possible.
The way I experienced PS over the years indeed had some emphasis on multiplayer. Often, I was way too lazy to learn a skill in order to complete a quest, so I just asked around to buy or earn crafted goods.
Finally, I do have the feeling that the dev's "intention" is to make the game fun to play - but getting there is a slow process. Yet, I think people like Venalan and Eonwind have already done so much more in this regard than previous "generations" of devs.

[bilbous]

A uniform green colored labyrinth does not sound like any place I have seen, perhaps you need to check your graphics drivers/setting.
Most of the quests require no skill, but the quest chains are somewhat problematic as you need to do unspecified quest x in order to receive quest y. Some of the quests require body parts of critters that new players cannot defeat but those parts can be bought from other players. Make sure to enable chat tabs beyond the basic setup -- options (hotkey o)->interface->chat tabs and select some or all of the checkboxes in the second column. I tend to uncheck everything in the first column so only dialog goes into the main chat tab. If there is nobody around, perhaps you are in an unfortunate time zone.

[cdmoreland]

You might consider joining a guild that will help you accomplish what you want to do. Ad Libertatem and others help players with everything from weapons and armor to quest chains for getting mounts and glyphs.

One of the great things about this game is the players that help others.

[Adash]

TO Echoes91:

No offense my friend, but the DEVS are doing a great job with this game.  Roughly every 2 months, a major update happens and most seem pleased with the results.  Open source, which implies that EVERYONE understands that no devs should be rushed to make the game better and devs will address issues from the BUG TRACKER, not forum onions of individual minds.  Please kindly stop whining and if you feel you cannot do something at this time because it has not be implemented or made possible, then patience is all you will get.  If you cannot wait for your own little petty needs, then perhaps it's time to gracefully say goodbye and move along citizen.

Perhaps you should try focusing on a different aspect of the game and try and proactively RP more with your community instead of grinding skills.  "Those who wait (even if its a few more years) will reap the rewards of good developer coding".

[Adash]

EXAMPLE:  I have been waiting for many years for the tailoring skill but it has not happened yet. 

I also struggled with the quests even their limitations, but with patience, the DEVS resolved the issues.
I also realize that some skills even if they are maxed still do not allow me to accomplish certain facets of the game because game mechanisms have not been balanced yet.  It is what it is so instead of whining I sought to focus on other skills in the game.

The point is this:  If your precious time is felt hindered, then it's time to go channel that time and energy else where away from PS.

[Pierre]

I don't want anyone playing to move along and suggestions for people to leave are unwelcome.

Comparing your patience with waiting for some esoteric skill with someone playing without a mount and with low stats is false.

I love the game and play it often.  Raising stats in this game is ridiculously difficult.  Leveling one weapon to have a half maxed skill - 100 out of 200 - takes months of grinding.

I play for the people only.  But there are long stretches every single day of approximately 15 people in the game.  I would say 10 hours per day has this number.

Agree with Boni, recent devs are awesome.  And they know things need changing, and they are changing.

But we NEED people like Echoes91 to post here, give opinions, for good or bad.  It's his or her own perspective and experience and we are lucky to hear it to be honest.  Most people do exactly as the last commenter said, even without one of us rudely suggesting it - they move along.

[Adash]

Stating "move along is a self-inflicted wound created by the whiner not a rude comment". Thanks for putting words or mislead concepts in my mouth.

The concept is very simple: IF you want change in the game, THEN code it yourself.  OTHERWISE, be humbled that this open source project so graciously is available to you.  Too makers takers, not enough doers.

[Echoes91]

I'm always happy when somebody answer to me and even more when a full RP conversation happens, unfortunately this happened so few times that i can remember ALL character's names who answered me once (and i have a bad memory for names) and only one who spontaneously spoken even if she'd never needed help from me, i don't know if i can write the name here but thanks a lot "K". Lately i asked to five or six chars who had just killed a Tefusang if they were interested in selling me its tooth, but never got an answer, and there's still no command to shake their shoulders. It may be that they all didn't spoke english, but a wider player base again would help.
Individual progress seems essential, and I think it takes too long. I still have not been able to bring any of my friends in this game, always because it takes too long to achieve anything.
By the way, i never argued about devel's work which i described as exceptional and huge, but about the choices they've made that I can't understand and, in my opinion, prevent the player base from growing as this game deserves.
So Adash, either you didn't read more than two or three words from my post or you have serious savvy problems. I know the meaning of Open Source at least as good as you do and devels already got all my respect

[Bonifarzia]

Lately i asked to five or six chars (..)  but never got an answer, and there's still no command to shake their shoulders.

That's surprising to me. Often, senior players are happy to help. Sometimes people busy with "mechanics" tend to miss messages in main chat (as it gets cluttered with attack/kill messages) - it may help to poke them with a /tell! Also, asking for help in the "gossip" chat might give you a response. Apart from this, there is actually an advisor system, which you can use via the "help" chat tab. Players who turned on advisor mode can answer your questions there. Finally, if you need a GM's help for any reason, do not hesitate to file a /petition. (Though: Might take a while to get a response.)
Okay, you probably know about all of these things as you have been around for a while, but maybe it is useful for other readers 

[Eonwind]

All feedbacks are always welcome even criticism is welcome if it's respectful.

Regarding some pointed issues I know settings devs are working on a a quest to allow a Pterosaur ride to BD fortress, however settings wise BD maps are meant to be far reached and dangerous places not the next bus stops, so afaik it will be possible to get a travel permit to after a (rather small I believe) quest chain.

Regarding the "green" dungeons it's should not be all green so there must be something wrong happening with graphic settings or something like that but even if there weren't any graphic bugs this place is meant to be a dangerous place for skilled players (since there are a lot of challenges), do not expect it to be easy to face right away. I think in the future its access may be "locked" by a quest which will hint players how dangerous that place can be, however writing quests is not a straightforward process so for now we choose to leave it open for everyone to explore.

Regarding the amount required to train a skill: well yes I know it really high (honestly reaching around rank 50 is something not too time consuming imo) but maxing out a skill is really time consuming. In my opinion a skill of 100 should be the craft of masters and getting to 200 should be something rare and exceptional, however some players use to feel like the characters is not "done" until it's maxed out, no matter what we say about it, so ... let's leave it be. Anyway I still feel it's too high and if it was for me I would have already lowered the amount of practice required but the project leader is not yet convinced of my theory. May be in the future that can be reconsidered.

Regarding the player base I really feel like adding contents and feature to the game (while surely helpful and much needed) is not the key for retaining a good player base. Like it has been shown by a beloved and former GM the keys are the events.

I want to be honest a small and volunteer project like our can not compete in term of graphic quality, amount of content released per year and new features added with the rest of games supported by commercial software houses; what makes PS unique and special IMO is it's strongly oriented toward RP with an interesting settings behind.

So if a player really want to help increase the player base I think the key is creating more events for other players. My 2 cents.

[Adash]

There is nothing wrong with the skill based system:  IF the devs made it hard to max it to 200, THEN so be it. 
IF certain skills are not hard to get to 200, THEN so be it.  Just take it for what it is and work hard, work hard, work hard, work hard. 

The life form that works the hardest reaps the greatest rewards. 
That has always been the most fair system since the beginning of time.

 





NOTE:  It's not wrong to leave slackers behind if their WILL is weak and they are not driven for success by any means possible.
ONLY EXCEPTION: It's wrong to leave slackers behind if the ones at the top of the food chain have rigged the system.

[Echoes91]

Events would surely help but they tend to be targeted usually at middle-advanced players who already got some good skills and stats and need something new to concentrate on. I think that the hardest part where this game loses most of new potential players is next to the beginning, with long unpleasant times (walking, trying, dying), hardly intuitable mechanics and very limited possibilities.

I want to be honest a small and volunteer project like our can not compete in term of graphic quality, amount of content released per year and new features added with the rest of games supported by commercial software houses; what makes PS unique and special IMO is it's strongly oriented toward RP with an interesting settings behind.

I totally agree, PS has a unique feeling to compensate these lacks and is a rare 3D graphical world that sill lets players use some imagination.

There is nothing wrong with the skill based system:  IF the devs made it hard to max it to 200, THEN so be it.
IF certain skills are not hard to get to 200, THEN so be it.  Just take it for what it is and work hard, work hard, work hard, work hard.

The life form that works the hardest reaps the greatest rewards.
That has always been the most fair system since the beginning of time.

Your reward will be an even more empty server so nobody will take away your jealously preserved skills, enjoy it. If I were part of the devels team I'd prefer somebody who suggest how to get the most from my work and make more happy users who could contribute in the future (remember anything like... open source?) instead of somebody who treats my choices as God's law in such a ridiculous way

[Adash]

Psychological mumbo jumbo and manipulation of words will not phase me.  No wonder society continues to degrade; every individual (most not all) is only interested in changing the variables to their own petty whims. 

I however do not do this and just appreciate the way things are now and allow the DEVS to use their best judgement to make this open source free project work to the best of human ability. 

once again, please kindly leave the barking outside and enter only when you actually have logic thought.


  very sneaky approach you have but I nor anyone else of intellect is going to be fooled.

[tman]

Training skills has actually gotten a lot easier in the last year or two.  More practice is given out and you no longer need to waste time finding trainers and paying for training.

Also, I really think this is key:

Regarding the amount required to train a skill: well yes I know it really high (honestly reaching around rank 50 is something not too time consuming imo) but maxing out a skill is really time consuming. In my opinion a skill of 100 should be the craft of masters and getting to 200 should be something rare and exceptional...

It really doesn't take a super long time to become competent in a skill (especially with the changes).  Maxing out takes forever but in my opinion is totally unnecessary.  That's just my opinion.

Now where new players are most disadvantaged is knowledge about the game mechanics, locations, etc.  This is where teamwork and finding older players to guide you helps.  New players a lot of times don't know where to ask for help (the guy pounding at the anvil or mining for 6 hours straight probably is less likely to help new players than role players in Kada El's).