Understand RPing Objectives

[Kaerli_Stronwylle]

So deductive puzzle solving?

Quite a bit of it, yes, whether it be in a traditional puzzle context, or a treatment of combat as a puzzle-solving exercise.

[Illysia]

Hmm. While it is obvious that puzzle solving has wide appeal, it is always hard to form puzzles that people actually want to unravel. I wonder if there is anything on how to create such puzzles be it for dungeon masters, writers, or anyone else? I guess the even bigger question is how to make people care enough to engage with the puzzle?

And that begs a bigger question yet, "What is it that makes you care about an RP regardless of the type of RP it is?"

For me, the best part of any RP is observing a personality individually and how it interacts with a group or someone else. I almost don't care what is going on as long as you get to see distinct personalities forced to act and react given some sort of catalyst. It's personality chemistry.

[Aramara Meibi]

And that begs a bigger question yet, "What is it that makes you care about an RP regardless of the type of RP it is?"

whether or not it sparks the interest of the character i'm playing.

[Tzarhunt]

Quote from: Aramara Meibi

Quote from: Illysia
And that begs a bigger question yet, "What is it that makes you care about an RP regardless of the type of RP it is?"


whether or not it sparks the interest of the character i'm playing.

I think this touches a very important point; things would probably be easier if considered from a character (as opposed to a player) point of view.
It seems to me that most people in this discussion are entirely absorbed in the metagaming aspect of things, which I think is the least direct (and therefore least reliable) way to consider roleplay.

I don't think people are consciously 'trying to get something out of' RP, other than pleasure, entertainment et cætera.

I believe it would be much more intuitive to consider what would engage a character in events, as opposed to what would engage a player in a RP. Players probably are more likely to let their character express themselves, and behave according to their nature, rather than actively try to attain their own objectives.

As I see it, the important part is to find a motivation suiting the character that is played. If a player feels his character engaged in something, they'll most surely go along.

Now if I had to find a thing that, as a player, I like in RP, it would probably be the writing; how the scenario was made, mostly if there are creative elements to it, an 'universe' behind it, how it all holds together, if it feels natural and possible, that sort of things. And of course the 'writing' (by lack of a better word) of each character involved.
 

[Illysia]

Easier in terms of making your own character act but not necessarily easier when trying to get other characters to play along.

When the player gets bored, it doesn't matter what the character does or does not like. This is how RPers often end up leaving, across a variety of games. They get tired of struggling OOCly and give up. While a character centric approach may or may not be more useful, you have to consider both aspects. The people in this thread are RPers, they brought these things up because they consider these metagame aspects when RPing...

However, fulfilling a character's personal goals is a reasonable objective from an individual perspective, but how does a player do that for other characters, particularly with characters they don't already know or have a connection to? Part of the reason for the metagame aspect of this thread is that I am asking in regards to creating RPs for groups of characters that may not have prior connections to each other which makes it easier to lure the player's interest than to fulfill the character's unknown goals. Deep connection take time, but you only have a short period of time to convince someone to jump in.

[Aramara Meibi]

i've said it before in other conversations, but i'll reiterate it here: When playing PS, I was always engaged in RP, meaning, everything done in the main channel, or on screen, was in character. Take for example, Aramara spent many hours at the furnaces and forge learning the art of blacksmithing because she wanted to make and sell shields. She was inspired to do so because of a story her mother used to tell her of a magical shield that was a gift of Xiosia. She also felt it was part of her duty to outfit the many adventurers of Hydlaa with a means of protection. This was all part of her character, and written into her backstory, and dictated how I, the player, interacted with the game.

Now, even while grinding away with the unintuitive crafting interface, I was still RPing, describing the actions she was taking while working in Main. Most often than not, Ara would strike up conversations with those working around her. It was her way of catching up on all the gossip. I feel that this kind of approach is how i derived enjoyment out of this game.

[Illysia]

Ah, that makes sense. Well that has only started working for me recently. In the past it became a guaranteed way to get ignored or clear an area of other players, so it got me out of the habit for a long time. But it does get more response now even if that typically doesn't lead to more than brief interactions. However, I don't think that method will work for say a plot or an event. It's better for more casual RP encounters but as more people stop to RP that will be enough to provide a drive into longer and more in depth RPs.


After thought:
Aha! I got it. The way you draw in the other people in this way is to give your character an issue, one that may actually be of concern to other characters or at least interesting, then hint at it but don't be too obvious about what "it" actually is. Let the other characters pursue their own paths of investigation withhold just enough information so that the player always feels that they are just on the edge of figuring out what is going on even if they aren't even close yet. If you can catch the initial interest of the other characters and their players, then unraveling the mystery is enough to hold them in the RP.

[Kaerli_Stronwylle]

Ah, that makes sense. Well that has only started working for me recently. In the past it became a guaranteed way to get ignored or clear an area of other players, so it got me out of the habit for a long time. But it does get more response now even if that typically doesn't lead to more than brief interactions. However, I don't think that method will work for say a plot or an event. It's better for more casual RP encounters but as more people stop to RP that will be enough to provide a drive into longer and more in depth RPs.


After thought:
Aha! I got it. The way you draw in the other people in this way is to give your character an issue, one that may actually be of concern to other characters or at least interesting, then hint at it but don't be too obvious about what "it" actually is. Let the other characters pursue their own paths of investigation withhold just enough information so that the player always feels that they are just on the edge of figuring out what is going on even if they aren't even close yet. If you can catch the initial interest of the other characters and their players, then unraveling the mystery is enough to hold them in the RP.

This sort of coy behavior from characters is a major gear-grinder for me, actually.  It boils down to a "do you really want your problem solved?" question, which can easily drive a character like mine straight out of your plot because your character(s) are being too obstinate about what's actually going on; either that, or you'll start seeing Kaerli basically trying to force the information out of you.   (Mind-reading, divination, etal)

[Kaerli_Stronwylle]

Hmm. While it is obvious that puzzle solving has wide appeal, it is always hard to form puzzles that people actually want to unravel. I wonder if there is anything on how to create such puzzles be it for dungeon masters, writers, or anyone else? I guess the even bigger question is how to make people care enough to engage with the puzzle?

And that begs a bigger question yet, "What is it that makes you care about an RP regardless of the type of RP it is?"

For me, the best part of any RP is observing a personality individually and how it interacts with a group or someone else. I almost don't care what is going on as long as you get to see distinct personalities forced to act and react given some sort of catalyst. It's personality chemistry.

For me, its solving the issues it raises, which is a large part of where my trouble with other RPers lies; they consider this to be such a trespass on the story they are trying to create that they do not consider it legitimate RP, even though the character is behaving in a manner consistent with their background, training, and prior behavior.

[Illysia]

The problem typically stems from trying to force a solution before other players have finished dealing with the consequences of the problem. If you solve a problem as soon as it arises, it never has a chance to become consequential and move RP.

[Aramara Meibi]

how do you, the player, know that you, the character, has solved the problem? people aren't math problems, they don't only have one clear cut solution. and most people with issues, well, it takes a long time for them to work them out.

you can't have "my character automatically is always right and correct about everything" as your character description. it's childish and godmodding.

[Kaerli_Stronwylle]

how do you, the player, know that you, the character, has solved the problem? people aren't math problems, they don't only have one clear cut solution. and most people with issues, well, it takes a long time for them to work them out.

you can't have "my character automatically is always right and correct about everything" as your character description. it's childish and godmodding.

On the other hand, most RPers expect the wrongness to be handed to them on a platter, instead of trying to force errors with tricks, traps, etal.

[Volki]

This sort of coy behavior from characters is a major gear-grinder for me, actually.  It boils down to a "do you really want your problem solved?" question, which can easily drive a character like mine straight out of your plot because your character(s) are being too obstinate about what's actually going on; either that, or you'll start seeing Kaerli basically trying to force the information out of you.   (Mind-reading, divination, etal)

Being blunt, you are not a great problem-solver. Solving a problem requires more than identifying the problem. I've enjoyed most of the roleplays I've had with you, but other people tend to just think you're forcing yourself upon them (which I honestly think is fun, but other people don't). Ironically, you have a problem that you cannot solve, Kaerli. People can tell you that you have a problem, but no one knows how to help you solve it.

I need brain fuel. bbl

[iridia]

Aside from all the different RP styles I think that the time one can spend on PS plays a big part in how certain scenario's are approached. Once you get involved in an RP, speaking for myself, you also want to know how it ends. In many ways it's like reading a good book, sometimes you just don't want to stop reading until the story ends.

[Illysia]

So you mean seeking the end of the story as an objective with time as a qualifier?