From heros to zeros!

[SaintNuclear]

Originally posted by Peeeevs
for oil??? HA i wish gas is not more than 2$ here in a place where its never ben more than 1.75 until the last 6 mouths

If you\'d bother reading the previous pages you\'d see that I said that saying the war was for oil is BS.

Originally posted by Monketh
Why do you think we went there then?

As I said earlier, the Omega Agency.

[Xordan]

We pay like $7 a gallon in the Uk.... I don\'t see what your problem is with $2

Anyway... u all believe what the media tell you. Our media never shows anything positive, only bad things. Which is why people are so negative against the whole war thing.

Final word: US can do what it likes. Who\'s gonna stop them? 3/4 of the world needs the US to survive, where the US could cut off all trade, and survive comfortably, while watching the rest of the world crumble into dust. Your opinions only matter, if u\'r a US citizan, and it\'s election time... although even then....

[Monketh]

Originally posted by Xordan
We pay like $7 a gallon in the Uk.... I don\'t see what your problem is with $2

Final word: US can do what it likes. Who\'s gonna stop them? 3/4 of the world needs the US to survive, where the US could cut off all trade, and survive comfortably, while watching the rest of the world crumble into dust. Your opinions only matter, if u\'r a US citizan, and it\'s election time... although even then....

I acknowledged that at the begining of the thread, but not all americans know that.  (Unfortunately...)

This is very true, a coup d\'etat dans les etats-unis would probably launch a worldwide depression.  Unlike a lot of people, we have the natural resources to do whatever we friggin\' want.  (With the prominent exception of oil, but that can be got along without if necessary.)

Let\'s use the rich-guy analogy: Everybody wants to be rich, but at the same time detests the rich.  

[Xordan]

You have Alaska for oil. You just havn\'t got around to drilling for it yet.

[SaintNuclear]

Originally posted by Xordan
3/4 of the world needs the US to survive, where the US could cut off all trade, and survive comfortably, while watching the rest of the world crumble into dust.

Sure, they can do that, but it\'s bad for them.
When you stop exporting, maybe the countries you export to stop getting the benefits from your products, but you stop getting the benefits of their money.

Also, once the US will close outgoing \\ incoming trade, the world will find out it don\'t really need the US in probebly less than a year.

E.g. the oil-rich countries of the Middle East used to export oil to the west in tankers through the Suez Canal. After a few years, the Suez Canal was closed to wide and deepen it so bigger tankers could pass.
Did the oil-rich countries crumbled to dust without the oil trade because of that? No! They built oil pipes that go from them to some place in the Mediterranean, and tankers stock themselves there instead of in the countries\' docks. It\'s alot cheaper to transfer the oil this way because it\'s faster and they don\'t get taxed in Suez.
So both sellers and buyers of oil earned from Suez\' short closing, and Egypt lost, because oil don\'t go through there (atleast not as before).


The same will probebly happen if the US closes it\'s gates. Sure, the US got some good stuff, but when the world will stop getting them, it\'ll only be a motivation to make even better stuff in other places


Edit: The US got
Alaska and Texas and maybe a few places with oil, but they stockpile it incase they get cut off of the Middle East oil supply from any reason (like when the Middle East will be dry of oil).

[Xordan]

Most countries will starve to death before that year has past. Most of Europe will never recover if the US did that. Most of those countries rely on the US. And why? Becuase they have no other way of getting what they need. Only The UK would survive. (Good relations with US. )

[Monketh]

Originally posted by Xordan
Most countries will starve to death before that year has past. Most of Europe will never recover if the US did that. Most of those countries rely on the US. And why? Becuase they have no other way of getting what they need. Only The UK would survive. (Good relations with US. )

Yep.  Not to mention how our ravenous consumption of anything and everything helps your exports.  

A closing off of the US would cause both a world-wide depression and a \'states-wide depression.  Look at the number of multi-national corporations that started here.  Honestly, what would 75% of the computing population do without Windoze?  If all the multi-national corporations that are based in America shut down across to globe, bam! right there, recession.  Now take away foreign aid, armies deployed in various parts of the world, small company trading, etc...

[tygerwilde]

Tyger: You may not claim responsibility, but your tax dollars are gonna pay for fixing it whether you like it or not.

hehe, the thing is, I get way more back from my taxes every year than I pay into them, so I don\'t actually support the government, now do I?

*goes back to golddigging.*

(this message brought to you from the commitee for the impeachment of G. Dubya Bush)

[TheTaintedSoul]

Originally posted by Monketh
Yep.  Not to mention how our ravenous consumption of anything and everything helps your exports.  

A closing off of the US would cause both a world-wide depression and a \'states-wide depression.  Look at the number of multi-national corporations that started here.  Honestly, what would 75% of the computing population do without Windoze?  If all the multi-national corporations that are based in America shut down across to globe, bam! right there, recession.  Now take away foreign aid, armies deployed in various parts of the world, small company trading, etc...

Yep it would be very bad for the rest of the world. However the USA cannot stand alone. Isolating themselves would affect the economy of the USA in a very negative way too. In fact the economies of Europe and the USA do rely on each other. Companies lose income created by export. And the USA very likely imports products it doesn\'t/can\'t make as well as products with higher quality then the american companies can provide.
On the very long term both the USA and rest of the world would recover. However the economy can never get to the level it is when working together.
If Windows was unavailable the solution is very simple, start using linux.
Even if im wrong whats the point? You\'re saying we don\'t need the rest of the world so we don\'t have to pay attention to their criticism and can do what we want?

[kyp14]

I think the US needs to learn to you\'se satire, they take themselves to seriously and rarely critise themselves except for maybe the simpsons but thats just one show.

In countries like Australia and England I think, satire is big, everybody joins in.

Whether it be comedic or otherwise, Americans need to learn to critise themselves and there goverment more and usaully the eventual result is for the better.

I mean I rarely see Americans make fun of George Bush or anyone in power at all. Where Australians make fun of Johnny Howard left right and center.

So basically my point here is that Americans should critise there goverment more instead of going for the old \"well he\'s from texas he\'s gotta be right\".

[Xordan]

We only critisize our government in the Uk coz our media does. Our media never shows anything positive, and makes our government look like they\'re doing everything wrong.

If everyone is encouraged to critisize, then the people won\'t vote them in the next elections, and will all vote for some other party. For example, the voting in of the Nazi party in Germany.

I\'m not saying people shouldn\'t critisize, but they shouldn\'t over do it like we do in the UK.

[TheTaintedSoul]

Originally posted by Xordan
We only critisize our government in the Uk coz our media does. Our media never shows anything positive, and makes our government look like they\'re doing everything wrong.

If everyone is encouraged to critisize, then the people won\'t vote them in the next elections, and will all vote for some other party. For example, the voting in of the Nazi party in Germany.

I\'m not saying people shouldn\'t critisize, but they shouldn\'t over do it like we do in the UK.

The nazi party was elected because of the extreme bad state the economy was in and the frustration the germans had because of the stupid treaty of versailles.
Criticism itself wasn\'t the problem in germany.

Of course only criticising makes an unworkable environment especially when you don\'t provide alternatives. A healthy criticism like with satire is needed, without it people get an unrealistic positive view. Thus overlooking problems and acting in dumb ways.
Having changing votes in elections is i think a good thing, no government should stay for a long period. Actually i consider it as one of the main reasons why democracy works.

[Monketh]

Originally posted by tygerwilde

Tyger: You may not claim responsibility, but your tax dollars are gonna pay for fixing it whether you like it or not.

hehe, the thing is, I get way more back from my taxes every year than I pay into them, so I don\'t actually support the government, now do I?

*goes back to golddigging.*

(this message brought to you from the commitee for the impeachment of G. Dubya Bush)

Bah, you hypocrite!  Milking the gov\'t for money, why should your vote count?  You wouldn\'t have supported Gore, after all, only undermine his finances.
This is the main reason we need a federal and state financial audit.  ...and people wonder why we have a deficit.  :rolleyes:

Kyp14: You don\'t read the american newpaper editorial pages do you?

Tainted: My point is, a lot of people are clueless about computers and need really friendly stuff like Windows to use a computer.   :rolleyes:

Now my other point is that if you put a great big wall around the US, stretching out into space, we\'d still be relatively well off.  We can shut down trade with one or two countries and still be more than okay.  As much as you hate us, if we dissappeared you\'d definitely miss us.

...and finally a less serious question: Is WWII the US\' responsiblility for letting the French\' emotions disrupt their rationality of how Germany could possibly recover with such a burden, or France\'s fault for getting too emotional and expecting all their losses back?  Or maybe is it The Wiemar (sp?)  Republic\'s fault for not killing Hitler when he tried to the over the gov\'t?


Edit: Pardon Tainted, I put a line there to mean that it was a seperate part of the message.  Not intended directly for you.  It\'s a broad generaliztion.

[TheTaintedSoul]

Originally posted by Monketh
Tainted: My point is, a lot of people are clueless about computers and need really friendly stuff like Windows to use a computer.   :rolleyes:

Now my other point is that if you put a great big wall around the US, stretching out into space, we\'d still be relatively well off.  We can shut down trade with one or two countries and still be more than okay.  As much as you hate us, if we dissappeared you\'d definitely miss us.

...and finally a less serious question: Is WWII the US\' responsiblility for letting the French\' emotions disrupt their rationality of how Germany could possibly recover with such a burden, or France\'s fault for getting too emotional and expecting all their losses back?  Or maybe is it The Wiemar (sp?)  Republic\'s fault for not killing Hitler when he tried to the over the gov\'t?

First of all what did i say that made you think i hate the US? I don\'t agree the way the US acts, don\'t really like the culture. I think some americans are to positive of the US. In general the US in my opinion acts arrogant as well as some americans do. But never have i hated america (or loved it). In fact there is no country i like or hate, only some governments i oppose or favor.

And then even if you are right, the USA doesn\'t need the world, which i seriously doubt (if you want to know why look back at the arguments i posted before). Then what does it have to do with this discussion. Again what is the point? Does it mean america shouldn\'t care about the rest of the world? Or their opinions?

About the second world war again i don\'t understand your response, i never said the cause of WWII had anything to do with the politics of the USA. No that would be ridiculous, UK and France were to blame as well as the economic state the world was in. Why i commented on the WWII was because i didn\'t agree with Xordan saying that the nazis gained influence because of criticism.
But since we are talking about the WWII, why do you think that the purpose of the marshall help was? This help had at least two reasons, to keep the communist influence out of western Europe. Secondly the USA needed a economically healthy europe for their own economy. Maybe that has changed by now, but with the globalisation the connection between them probably only got stronger and more important.

Im not entirely sure so correct me if im wrong but it just occured to me that it was the president of the USA who pushed France and UK to make the treaty of versailles in the way it was and have Germany pay a severe price for the war. Im not entirely sure so correct me if im wrong but th

[tygerwilde]

actually, an audit wouldn\'t change a thing for me. I bring in more than I contribute because I don\'t earn enough for the government to take out taxes, therefore I get a refund of all paid taxes. I also get EIC for both of my children, roughly 800 total extra.

and it\'s entirely legal.

it\'s all a matter of unemployment, I don\'t actively try to welch off of the government, but this area is really bad employment wise. I can\'t keep a job myself, due to a learning disability, and my wife can\'t find a job locally that pays more than 10k a year. right now she\'s working at mcdonalds, about 20 hours a week. we\'re living off her $200-$300 a month, and our 350 welfare. not to mention the 3k that I borrowed for school. school loans are untaxable. found that out beginning of the year. when we get out of school, we\'re going to move to either california or New York, where there are jobs and become taxpayers